Bobsbeer
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Post by Bobsbeer on Feb 26, 2015 18:57:32 GMT
At the moment there seems to be 3 systems that can control temperature in the atty. The DNA 40 from Evolve, the VIR from Imeo and one I can't seem to find much about by Dicodes. The latter two seem to work with stainless steel or titanium coils the former with nickel. While I don't claim to understand how any of them work, they seem to. But apart from units containing the DNA40 chip/board I can't see any available with the other systems. Are the theoretical systems or do they actually exist? I have seen a video of VIR being used in the testing research on temperature currently in progress and it looks good. But I can't find anyone actually selling it. Anyone know anything about these systems? Apart from the DNA40 are the others virtual concepts or real world units?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 26, 2015 22:44:21 GMT
Never heard of the others you mention, I only know about the Evolv chip and the clone KX 40D
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macmagoo
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Post by macmagoo on Feb 26, 2015 23:01:57 GMT
Don't know about the VIR but Dicodes Dani if I remember correctly has a 5W - 20W chip in it but it does not do temperature control.
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letsavit
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Post by letsavit on Feb 26, 2015 23:18:31 GMT
Never heard of the others you mention, I only know about the Evolv chip and the clone KX 40D Good thread to confirm what boards are actually working with regards to temp control. I am quoting car147 because theses are the only two that i know can do it and the moment? Smok we can write off and isn't there is a board in some hana mods that's useless too? Evolv still have the edge, just seems slightly better to me, the ramp up and the control. They brought it to market and deserve the credit IMHO and although I'm being hypocritical as I own my fair share of clones if you want the tech to move forwards then money needs to be spent in the right places.
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Bobsbeer
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Post by Bobsbeer on Feb 27, 2015 15:32:39 GMT
Here is a video of the VIR being tested. This is part of the temperature research project not marketing.
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VapingBad
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Post by VapingBad on Feb 28, 2015 15:28:25 GMT
I would stick with a nickel system as I think it will be the de-facto standard because it has a considerably higher temperature resistance coefficient that means it would be considerably more accurate for measuring the temperature and there are several replaceable coils available using it. The YiHi temp limiting boards (SX Mini J) and I thing the Smok mods will also be using nickel.
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Bobsbeer
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Post by Bobsbeer on Mar 1, 2015 15:06:36 GMT
I don't disagree with you VapingBad, and it is early days for temperature control in vaping, but I can see this being the future direction. Probably a bit like video in the early days with VHS and Betamax wars, in terms of the coil being used. No doubt once the trend is started there will be further inovation and methods.
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VapingBad
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Post by VapingBad on Mar 1, 2015 15:24:22 GMT
I don't disagree with you VapingBad, and it is early days for temperature control in vaping, but I can see this being the future direction. Probably a bit like video in the early days with VHS and Betamax wars, in terms of the coil being used. No doubt once the trend is started there will be further inovation and methods. I think the coil being used is the best is is going to get with the open system (separate battery and atomiser connected with 510). Measuring the coil temp is an excellent method and is far superior to a single point measurement. Remember that the driving force is to ensure that we don't overheat the liquid and what could be better at this than measuring at the hottest point in the system. There will be gains to be had in the firmware & control electronics, but these would be from experience as the tech already exists it would be more like tuning IMO. Probably the biggest change we will see is making it more user friendly. We may see a different type of system, but not using a 510 connection and your favourite atty.
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VapingBad
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Post by VapingBad on Mar 1, 2015 15:53:54 GMT
Thanks for linking to Dr Konstantinos Farsalinos's videos Bobsbeer, I just had an epiphany watching "E-cigarettes temperature control: VG vs PG" as to why I seem to be getting better results than some with temp limiting, especially at 400 - 410 F because I vape 100% PG and although I knew that VG has a higher boiling point I didn't realise that it is not even producing much vapour at these temperatures. I know the flavour is generally cleaner at lower temps and this would explian why some people aren't experiencing the difference in flavour that some of us get. I imagine that ppl who vape PG VG mixes at this point are moving their effective ratio toward PG. Food for thought. I won't be popular saying that I feel that the recent rise in VG ratios is a negative thing for vaping, I have felt this for a while as big clouds are a big turn off for the non vaping public and we are just handing the antz a massive chunk of ammunition. Now this video brings home what we already knew that you have to use higher temperatures, which may be more risky we will have to wait for the conclusion of his study to know, but will likely have an effect on the flavourings. I have also read that there is an increased risk of producing formaldehyde vaping VG/PG mix as to get the VG to work well you are going over the PG boiling point, I imagine that this is unlikely in all but the most extreme set-ups.
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blakey
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Post by blakey on Mar 1, 2015 17:06:15 GMT
Thanks for linking to Dr Konstantinos Farsalinos's videos Bobsbeer, I just had an epiphany watching "E-cigarettes temperature control: VG vs PG" as to why I seem to be getting better results than some with temp limiting, especially at 400 - 410 F because I vape 100% PG and although I knew that VG has a higher boiling point I didn't realise that it is not even producing much vapour at these temperatures. I know the flavour is generally cleaner at lower temps and this would explian why some people aren't experiencing the difference in flavour that some of us get. I imagine that ppl who vape PG VG mixes at this point are moving their effective ratio toward PG. Food for thought. I won't be popular saying that I feel that the recent rise in VG ratios is a negative thing for vaping, I have felt this for a while as big clouds are a big turn off for the non vaping public and we are just handing the antz a massive chunk of ammunition. Now this video brings home what we already knew that you have to use higher temperatures, which may be more risky we will have to wait for the conclusion of his study to know, but will likely have an effect on the flavourings. I have also read that there is an increased risk of producing formaldehyde vaping VG/PG mix as to get the VG to work well you are going over the PG boiling point, I imagine that this is unlikely in all but the most extreme set-ups. I've been thinking for some time that the cloud chasers will do us no good as a whole. Can you imagine the shock of a non smoker seeing great plumes of vapour emitting from a persons mouth and can you really blame that person for not wanting to be in the same room It's one thing that would be sure to turn those sitting on the fence against us. Can you imagine it on public transport, cinemas, restaurants All this right when we need as much public backing as we can get!
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drunkenbum
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Post by drunkenbum on Mar 1, 2015 17:53:14 GMT
I'm a bit clueless when it comes to the whole temp control thing. Am I right in thinking the idea is to keep the temp down at higher watts so the flavour is as it should be rather than burnt?
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VapingBad
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Post by VapingBad on Mar 1, 2015 18:28:55 GMT
I'm a bit clueless when it comes to the whole temp control thing. Am I right in thinking the idea is to keep the temp down at higher watts so the flavour is as it should be rather than burnt? The main aim is safety: not heating your liquid to temperatures where unintended chemical compounds are produced and this also prevents burning wicks & dry hits. Everything else is a bonus, I find the flavour better but some people don't notice a differience. The watts are irrelivante as poor wicking, poor airflow or poor coils can all cause hot spots at even low watts, it would almost certainly be unvappable it if anything really nasty was produced in any quantity. I think it is well worth it for the flavour I get alone and the pre heat on DNA40 is awesome it brings my dual 3 mm steel rope wicks up to temperature so fast I don't notice a lag and find the same with cotton. I also get cleaner wicks with temp limiting.
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drunkenbum
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Post by drunkenbum on Mar 1, 2015 18:42:36 GMT
I'm a bit clueless when it comes to the whole temp control thing. Am I right in thinking the idea is to keep the temp down at higher watts so the flavour is as it should be rather than burnt? The main aim is safety: not heating your liquid to temperatures where unintended chemical compounds are produced and this also prevents burning wicks & dry hits. Everything else is a bonus, I find the flavour better but some people don't notice a differience. The watts are irrelivante as poor wicking, poor airflow or poor coils can all cause hot spots at even low watts, it would almost certainly be unvappable it if anything really nasty was produced in any quantity. I think it is well worth it for the flavour I get alone and the pre heat on DNA40 is awesome it brings my dual 3 mm steel rope wicks up to temperature so fast I don't notice a lag and find the same with cotton. I also get cleaner wicks with temp limiting. Interesting. I've got to admit whenever I've seen people talking about temp control I've just been baffled as to why You would need it. Perhaps I can use research as an excuse to buy a DNA 40 lol
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