Sony VTC5

[Tom]

Just found this... and stole it all... thought it might be interesting reading for someone.

It is not my own work or opinion...


What do all those numbers and letters really mean?

Battery identification can be one of the most difficult aspects of battery purchasing. All batteries are not created equal and just because two batteries are labeled IMR18650, does not mean they have the same capabilities, characteristics and safety features.

The batteries we use in e-cigarettes generally follow an industry defined identification scheme consisting of 3 letters followed by 5 numbers, ie. IMR18650, ICR14500, NCR18650 etc. The first three letters indicate the battery basic construction and capabilities. The following series of numbers indicate the batteries approximate physical size.

The entire sequence can be broken down as such:

The first letter indicates the basic chemical makeup of the battery. "I" indicates the battery is a Lithium Ion class battery.

The second, and most important letter indicates the material. "C" indicates the material as cobalt; "M" indicates manganese; "N" indicates nickel. Knowing this, "ICR" means Li-Ion/cobalt; "IMR" means Li-Ion/manganese. Using manganese or nickel makes the battery a "safer chemistry" and in most cases a "high drain" battery. The newer IMR/hybrid batteries use a mixture of ICR and IMR chemistries to gain the better attributes of both.

ICR batteries are not considered safe chemistry or high drain batteries, and are considered to be obsolete for mod use. ICR batteries vent flames and can explode when they go into thermal runaway. Their amp limits are typically less than 4 amps. These are best used for flashlights or other low drain applications.

Battery capacity (how long a battery should last on a charge) is listed as a "mAh" rating. It's not an exact science, but 100 mAh is roughly equal to 1 hour battery use. 2000 mAh should last roughly 20 hours use. 700 mAh should last 7 hours.

The battery identifier described above tells a basic story on what the battery can handle, but for an ecigarette, and more notably modders, one of the most important ratings is the maximum continuous discharge rate. The maximum discharge rate (amps) became more prevalent when vapors started building their own coils. With the natural progression of things, our extreme inner drive to produce more vapor, and sub-ohm (< 1.0 ohm) resistance coils, we are dancing dangerously close to the physical limitations of lithium ion batteries.

An atomizer coil draws a specific amount of current (amps) from the battery. That current must not be more than the total amps in continuous discharge rate of the battery, or very bad things could happen.

Amp ratings: The maximum continuous discharge rate is a battery specification which indicates how much current (Amps) you can draw from the battery without causing physical harm to the battery. Pull more than the maximum discharge rating and the battery becomes unstable, goes into a irreversable state of thermal runaway and can exhaust hot gasses, flames or explode. Quite often, a mod's features will include terms like “battery vent holes”. These holes are in place to safely guide hot gasses and flames away from your face in the case of most battery failures so the mod does not become a pipe bomb from the pressure buildup of gases.

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The difference in the 18650 purple Efest batteries are in the mAh rating (battery capacity, or how long the battery should last on a charge during use) and the amp rating. Be aware that Efest and a few other brands are inconsistant in how in how they report their battery specs. These brands often list the "pulse" amp rating, and not the "continuous discharge" amp rating. Purple Efest Batteries Not As Advertised

As far as your general regulated VV/VW 18650 mods, you only need to use a high drain IMR battery with 10 amps. This is because of the PWM circuitry which can draw up to 9 amps from the battery. After that first priority is met, choose the battery with the higher mAh rating.

The high wattage DNA 20 - 50 watt regulated mods will need a 20 - 30 amp battery (minimum 12 amp high drain battery).

If using sub-ohm coils on a mechanical mod, one must use an Ohm's Law calculator to determine how many amps are required for the ohm of the coil that is going to be built. This may require a 20 - 30 amp battery.

List of high drain IMR batteries and their amp ratings
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The AW IMR batteries are argueably the most reliable and consistant battery on the market. Are there batteris which last longer on a charge? Yes there are. Are there batteries which have a higher amp rating? Yes there are. However, for general purpose use AW batteries are the best batteries available.

Not all batteries are created equal when they leave the factory. AW (Andrew Wan) is a battery distributor in Hong Kong who buys large shipments from the better manufacturers in Japan. He and his staff inspect/test each individual battery for quality and performance. The top tier get chosen to become AW batteries.

[jmw2309]

I have 2 ordered from torchy that are apparently in the post. Will let you know when they arrive!

[VapingBad]

Sept 26, 2014 22:15:25 GMT Tom said:

The purple efest ''35a'' have been reported by a number of sources to have a 20a continuous drain... while not being too bad (as long as your using within those limits) that is not as advertised.

I think the general consensus is they are rewrapped lg 20a batts.

But who bloody knows.

Tis so (24:00)

[Marcus]

Samsung inr 25r are great batteries as well!
Reported pulse rating of 100A (those figures are from congrevape)

Have seen a few batteries which are rebranded VTC4S
I get all my vtc5 from "torchy" and "ecolux" via ebay.
Great prices and great service

[Montana]

At the moment I have two of the , how shall we put it, "Variable" purple Efest 2500mah 35A 18650 batteries and have only had them for a relatively short time ( just under 2 months  and I didn't use them for a whole week of that time ) and they are only lasting a half a day from fully charged to going to "Orange" ( On my VTR ) , at which point I replace it with the other one.Just a shaort time before my fire button on my VTR goes to "Orange" I can taste a difference , I didn't think you would be able to do that , my taste buds must be coming back to me.

I saw ronaldo put on another thread that he would only use these ( the above Efest batteries ) in a torch , not a great endorsement.SO , what I'm saying is , IF Sony aren't going to make the VTC5's as available as they were , what would be a viable option ? At the moment I'm only using them in a VV/VW mod , but I'm looking to get a mech mod and a RTA ( type ) in the near future , so I want to get as good a battery as I can.So quality, performance and safety is what I'm after and if possible as big a mah as I can get for the length of time they can be used for.


Andy

[VapingBad]

I find the VTC4 so convenient as they are 2100 mAh & have a max charge rate of 4 A so I charge them at 2 A in 75 mins and get through 2 or 3 in an average day. They are only 20 % less capacity than the VTC5 and I don't think that I would notice the difference in how I carry a spare battery, I would get through 2 of either on a long night out.

[enjay]

Sept 26, 2014 22:07:05 GMT Village idiot formerly tjlumle said:

Im after 2 good batteries for a kato and an xxix I may try subbing on the xxix so after a good batt for that I think I have a spare vt5 somewhere indoors just need to find it

Might try?!! Get it done already! I run my xxix with a modded tobh down at 0.06 ohms mostly, what a mod! Love it!

Speaking of batteries though VapingBad I've just got 4 vtc3's, supposed to be the hardest hitting out of the vtc's apparently. Got to bed them in gently in the kfl+ though, maybe 4 or 5 cycles then boom! It's sub ohm time!

[VapingBad]

Sept 27, 2014 0:58:24 GMT enjay said:

Sept 26, 2014 22:07:05 GMT Village idiot formerly tjlumle said:

Im after 2 good batteries for a kato and an xxix I may try subbing on the xxix so after a good batt for that I think I have a spare vt5 somewhere indoors just need to find it

Might try?!! Get it done already! I run my xxix with a modded tobh down at 0.06 ohms mostly, what a mod! Love it!

Speaking of batteries though VapingBad I've just got 4 vtc3's, supposed to be the hardest hitting out of the vtc's apparently. Got to bed them in gently in the kfl+ though, maybe 4 or 5 cycles then boom! It's sub ohm time!

I think they benefit from not cramming the capacity, I know the spec for the 5 has higher internal res than the 4 & 3.  I have 10 VTC4 and doubt I will change them until they are worn out and bet I would feel the same about the VTC3s.  Mainly I'm on a DNA @ 25 W (+/- 5 W geni), some times IPV2 @ 40 W (+/- 10 W dripper) and on mechs I liked about 0.6 ? so not nearly as demanding customer as you are enjay.

[enjay]

Sept 27, 2014 1:30:50 GMT VapingBad said:

Sept 27, 2014 0:58:24 GMT enjay said:

Might try?!! Get it done already! I run my xxix with a modded tobh down at 0.06 ohms mostly, what a mod! Love it!

Speaking of batteries though VapingBad I've just got 4 vtc3's, supposed to be the hardest hitting out of the vtc's apparently. Got to bed them in gently in the kfl+ though, maybe 4 or 5 cycles then boom! It's sub ohm time!

I think they benefit from not cramming the capacity, I know the spec for the 5 has higher internal res than the 4 & 3.  I have 10 VTC4 and doubt I will change them until they are worn out and bet I would feel the same about the VTC3s.  Mainly I'm on a DNA @ 25 W (+/- 5 W geni), some times IPV2 @ 40 W (+/- 10 W dripper) and on mechs I liked about 0.6 ? so not nearly as demanding customer as you are enjay.

Yeh got six of the vtc4's, a couple of the samsung 20R's then these new ones today. I prefer the 4's over the 5's though, nothing I've read so far convinces me otherwise

[cHooBeyDoo]

What are your thoughts on the LG DB HE2 18650 35A (Also available HERE cheaper!)

[Ripshod]

Sept 27, 2014 8:36:33 GMT cHooBeyDoo said:

What are your thoughts on the LG DB HE2 18650 35A (Also available HERE cheaper!)

That's another misquoted spec. They're only rated at 20 Amps continuous. However I use them I sub-ohm on them fine - I don't intend on going below 0.5 ohms, so they suit me fine. Good battery.

35 amps is the pulse rating.

Although, if you look at the specs box, everything is quoted correctly 

[cHooBeyDoo]

Sept 27, 2014 8:39:54 GMT Ripshod said:

Sept 27, 2014 8:36:33 GMT cHooBeyDoo said:

What are your thoughts on the LG DB HE2 18650 35A (Also available HERE cheaper!)

That's another misquoted spec. They're only rated at 20 Amps continuous. However I use them I sub-ohm on them fine - I don't intend on going below 0.5 ohms, so they suit me fine. Good battery.

35 amps is the pulse rating.

Although, if you look at the spacs box, everything is quoted correctly 

That's why I asked TBH, I bought 2 the other day (when they were cheaper, LOL) for using in my Focal Hana clone with a KFL+ but I won't be going sub ohm any time soon.
So far so good for me too

[arron]

I use the purple efest, both 30a and 35a.
Perfect for me, good battery life, good price and readily available!

I don't enjoy sub ohming, and i don't go above 10a when I do use a dripper (which is rare)

If purple efest are good enough for grimmgreen then they're good enough for me

[jmw2309]

2 from torchy arrived today. Re wrapped but assume vtc5's!

[Montana]

Sept 27, 2014 12:24:22 GMT arron said:

I use the purple efest, both 30a and 35a.
Perfect for me, good battery life, good price and readily available!

I don't enjoy sub ohming, and i don't go above 10a when I do use a dripper (which is rare)

If purple efest are good enough for grimmgreen then they're good enough for me

I seem to have had a couple of their not so good ones, less than two months old, and not lasting that long "in the green" in my VTR.So I think I'm going to have to get some from Torchy.

Some have been known to be ok and some not, there seems to be a big variation in quality , pity for 2 reasons , first - on paper they seem to be good , secondly - price and availability.


Andy