DNA40 - Temp Control - Nickel Builds

[Deleted]

Nov 28, 2014 18:23:38 GMT Tom said:

Nov 28, 2014 18:05:59 GMT @scooby said:

Good to see this thread started Tom not had much time today but have twisted some NI200 and been thinking a lot

As a side note, on the steam-engine link to your build has anyone set a desired wattage and used the heat flux and capacity figures when building a coil?

literally don't even know what that stuff means



will definitely look into it though!

After a little research I found that the heat flux is to how much heat energy is given off from a unit area (mm2) of the coil's surface. Adjust the watts up from 10 and see the fire symbol change from blue (cool) to red (hot).

And the heat capacity is to how much heat energy is required to raise the temperature of a material by 1 K (temperature) per unit mass.

Of course i couldn't find out what that meant   but in my search I did come across this which really is well worth a read for any DNA40 user.  

[michnig]

Tom
Those Vaporshark skins you looking for without the fire button being covered are available on "The Vape Lab" £6.00 but postage is high.

[Deleted]

Nov 28, 2014 22:17:01 GMT michnig said:

my bad sorry, rewound 10 wraps now reading 0.28ohms, does that sound better...

As Tom said it should result in 0.15ohms see here

[michnig]

Cheers for that @scooby

[Deleted]

I have 3 of the skins from Vapeescape and the fire button is exposed but not the up/down, which is good as it stops them rattling

The DNA40 is slightly thicker than the 30 but the skin stretches to fit ok. I have heard that there will be a dedicated DNA40 skin though.

[Tom]

Nov 28, 2014 22:22:44 GMT @scooby said:

Nov 28, 2014 18:23:38 GMT Tom said:

literally don't even know what that stuff means



will definitely look into it though!

After a little research I found that the heat flux is to how much heat energy is given off from a unit area (mm2) of the coil's surface. Adjust the watts up from 10 and see the fire symbol change from blue (cool) to red (hot).

And the heat capacity is to how much heat energy is required to raise the temperature of a material by 1 K (temperature) per unit mass.

Of course i couldn't find out what that meant   but in my search I did come across this which really is well worth a read for any DNA40 user.  

what a great read.

will add to OP

[VapingBad]

Nov 28, 2014 22:22:44 GMT @scooby said:

In my search I did come across this which really is well worth a read for any DNA40 user.  

A very good read you found there.

But I have found that sometimes the SteamEngine calc to be way off EG. this early Kayfun build I still have going it gives more than twice the actual wraps, the tails are wrapped completely around the posts and well tightened and the resistance has not drifted over 4 weeks. It has had the wick changed a few times and on each occasion I checked the terminals were tight and the coil glows correctly. I found the same as the write up with connection issues and posted about it about 4 weeks ago and since have been very diligent about it especially with twisted coils.

Physical: 10 wrap twisted 0.2 mm around 3.2 mm former measures 0.16 ?.
SteamEngine: gives 27 wraps! link

EDIT: I had put the wrong diameter into SE and it gives 7.66 wraps, still out, but not as massive error.


But it only 20% extra wraps with this Kraken build:
Physical: 7 wraps of twisted 0.16 mm Nickel around 2.55 mm wicks 0.11 ?
SteamEngine: gives 8.5 wraps link
I built the SE spec first and found I could loose 3 wraps so did it again.


It is spot on with this Orchid build 8 wraps of twisted 0.16 mm (34 AWG) Ni200 around a 2.5 mm former 0.11 ? with Japanese cotton wicks. SteamEnigine . I got this right because I used the dimensions from the Kraken build above.


I will keep using SteamEngine as it normally gets you close, but there is no substitute for making and measuring.

Resistance taken from the DNA, my resistance meter over reads about 20% at these levels.

[davetherayon]

Flip, Dave Dorn was right in coining the DNA40 as a 'fourth generation' board. That temperature control is changing the face of coiling...!

[Tom]

VapingBad I completely agree about personal experience and measuring to be the best way.

When you introduce twisted coils you are also introducing another variable, the density and number of twists, I think this is why there is some difference. But 27 wraps! Lol

Great that we can share and all learn off each other.

Will be trying your twisted kayfun build next week

[VapingBad]

Nov 29, 2014 12:53:48 GMT Tom said:

VapingBad I completely agree about personal experience and measuring to be the best way.

When you introduce twisted coils you are also introducing another variable, the density and number of twists, I think this is why there is some difference. But 27 wraps! Lol

Great that we can share and all learn off each other.

Will be trying your twisted kayfun build next week

SteamEngine does do twisted and has a setting for the length of each twisted, just strange they got twisted dual a lot more accurate than twisted single.   I just noticed the link for that had disappeared and have re-added it.

[Tom]

Nov 29, 2014 13:01:35 GMT VapingBad said:

Nov 29, 2014 12:53:48 GMT Tom said:

VapingBad I completely agree about personal experience and measuring to be the best way.

When you introduce twisted coils you are also introducing another variable, the density and number of twists, I think this is why there is some difference. But 27 wraps! Lol

Great that we can share and all learn off each other.

Will be trying your twisted kayfun build next week

SteamEngine does do twisted and has a setting for the length of each twisted, just strange they got twisted dual a lot more accurate than twisted single.   I just noticed the link for that had disappeared and have re-added it.

Maybe something slightly out in their equation for twisted.

It will be my first time twisting wire so will do some reading up on it

[Deleted]

Nov 29, 2014 12:25:42 GMT davetherayon said:

Flip, Dave Dorn was right in coining the DNA40 as a 'fourth generation' board. That temperature control is changing the face of coiling...!

I feel it is bringing to light things that I didn't think about before, and can only help understand how to get the most from a coil in different circumstances. Not only with TP but regular kanthal builds as well.


I always doubt SE for kanthal VapingBad but so far in my limited experience (3 coils ) it has got me within 0.01 Ohms each time with Ni.

It also begs the question, what is the tolerance on the wire sizes from different suppliers. At such small dia and resistance, slight variation would have quite an impact.

Edit all have been twisted 1mm pitch

[VapingBad]

Tom it is more prone to connection problems especially after a few heat cycles, if your resistance suddenly rises of the heat limit cuts in far too low you probably need to tighten one of your connections.

[davetherayon]

DNA40 specs including pinout diagram for modders. The connections are in a very different position from DNA30, mostly clustered in a row along the rightmost edge looking down on the board topside with the long side down.

[michnig]

Hi. Well my Vaporshark DNA40 has arrived .
Im well pleased with it, put a .23 ohm coil in a Squape mk1, set temp to 440 deg and 25watts,its fantastic,ive never enjoyed 25watts so much, no burning ,no over heat. The only problem is the Squape air flow is poor.
Next coiled up the Plume veil at .18 ohms set temp to 450 deg and 30 watts with all air channels open," this is the high life"
Weve never had it so good, I agree with DD this well could be generation 4. Im gobsmacked...