Bulk TPA Concentrate?

[Dan]

Hey everyone, 

Does anyone know where I can possibly source large (100ml+) bottles of TPA vanilla custard concentrate here in the UK? (Or even in the EU!)

(Edited - Looking for TPA VC concentrate now instead of Capella)

[Perpetua]

I'd try emailing Abe at Liberty Flights or any of the UK Capella VC Dan . . . Terry at Leisure Liquids also stocks it, but he's just gone on holiday so won't be about to answer.

If you fill your cart on Capella's website, you can get a shipping quote, but one thing to remember is that you'll almost certainly be hit for Customs on a purchase from Capella. I certainly have been and a group buy we did on the forum also attracted charges. That added another £18 to my small personal order and £75(ish) on the GB one.

There's very little difference between Capella's and TPA's VC in all honesty . . . if anything I think TPA's is maybe a teeny bit nicer.

[Dan]

Aug 26, 2013 20:09:13 GMT Perpetua said:

I'd try emailing Abe at Liberty Flights or any of the UK Capella VC Dan . . . Terry at Leisure Liquids also stocks it, but he's just gone on holiday so won't be about to answer.

If you fill your cart on Capella's website, you can get a shipping quote, but one thing to remember is that you'll almost certainly be hit for Customs on a purchase from Capella. I certainly have been and a group buy we did on the forum also attracted charges. That added another £18 to my small personal order and £75(ish) on the GB one.

There's very little difference between Capella's and TPA's VC in all honesty . . . if anything I think TPA's is maybe a teeny bit nicer.

Hi Mandy

I've had an answer back from Alchemists and they have said that they wouldn't be able to supply at anymore discount due to shipping,duty,bottling,etc.

I'm just waiting to hear back from Carrie at the moment.. She's done good by me so far and so I would prefer to order from her if she's able to do anything...I already have a fairly substantial order to place with her anyway so would save on postage if nothing else!

I don't think Abe stocks the VC concentrates.. I've looked several times but can't find them on his site for the life of me!

I have found this though, which works out at around £17 + postage for 100mls if that's of any interest to any Capella users?

Regarding TPA vs Capella.. After spending the evening researching, I'm going for the TPA..

Not only are you not the first to say that the TPA has a slight edge but I also don't like Capella's dishonesty about this whole diacetyl thing... They say that their VC contains none whatsoever, yet I've read of at least two independent tests that say different... Even if it is only minute!!

[jonn]

Aug 26, 2013 21:57:06 GMT Dan said:

Aug 26, 2013 20:09:13 GMT Perpetua said:

I'd try emailing Abe at Liberty Flights or any of the UK Capella VC Dan . . . Terry at Leisure Liquids also stocks it, but he's just gone on holiday so won't be about to answer.

If you fill your cart on Capella's website, you can get a shipping quote, but one thing to remember is that you'll almost certainly be hit for Customs on a purchase from Capella. I certainly have been and a group buy we did on the forum also attracted charges. That added another £18 to my small personal order and £75(ish) on the GB one.

There's very little difference between Capella's and TPA's VC in all honesty . . . if anything I think TPA's is maybe a teeny bit nicer.

Hi Mandy

I've had an answer back from Alchemists and they have said that they wouldn't be able to supply at anymore discount due to shipping,duty,bottling,etc.

I'm just waiting to hear back from Carrie at the moment.. She's done good by me so far and so I would prefer to order from her if she's able to do anything...I already have a fairly substantial order to place with her anyway so would save on postage if nothing else!

I don't think Abe stocks the VC concentrates.. I've looked several times but can't find them on his site for the life of me!

I have found this though, which works out at around £17 + postage for 100mls if that's of any interest to any Capella users?

Regarding TPA vs Capella.. After spending the evening researching, I'm going for the TPA..

Not only are you not the first to say that the TPA has a slight edge but I also don't like Capella's dishonesty about this whole diacetyl thing... They say that their VC contains none whatsoever, yet I've read of at least two independent tests that say different... Even if it is only minute!!

That toscanamall.com is rather dear Dan. The price of 19.80 euros is for 50ml only! You can get 60ml for £17.18 from frogster.
Only Liberty Flights do 100ml bottles of TPA flavourings, unfortunately no custard one.

[Dan]

Aug 26, 2013 23:05:49 GMT jonn said:

Aug 26, 2013 21:57:06 GMT Dan said:

Hi Mandy

I've had an answer back from Alchemists and they have said that they wouldn't be able to supply at anymore discount due to shipping,duty,bottling,etc.

I'm just waiting to hear back from Carrie at the moment.. She's done good by me so far and so I would prefer to order from her if she's able to do anything...I already have a fairly substantial order to place with her anyway so would save on postage if nothing else!

I don't think Abe stocks the VC concentrates.. I've looked several times but can't find them on his site for the life of me!

I have found this though, which works out at around £17 + postage for 100mls if that's of any interest to any Capella users?

Regarding TPA vs Capella.. After spending the evening researching, I'm going for the TPA..

Not only are you not the first to say that the TPA has a slight edge but I also don't like Capella's dishonesty about this whole diacetyl thing... They say that their VC contains none whatsoever, yet I've read of at least two independent tests that say different... Even if it is only minute!!

That toscanamall.com is rather dear Dan. The price of 19.80 euros is for 50ml only! You can get 60ml for £17.18 from frogster.
Only Liberty Flights do 100ml bottles of TPA flavourings, unfortunately no custard one.

For some reason I thought it was 100ml

[kurotoshiro]

Aug 26, 2013 21:57:06 GMT Dan said:

I also don't like Capella's dishonesty about this whole diacetyl thing... They say that their VC contains none whatsoever, yet I've read of at least two independent tests that say different... Even if it is only minute!!

I approve of this stance. Even though you're risking trace amounts of diacetyl either way, why not choose to buy from the (only) company who are actually open and explicit about it?

[kailey]

Dan have you seen this:

shop.perfumersapprentice.com/p-7166-vanilla-custard-flavor.aspx

Vanilla Custard Flavor

water soluble

a rich, buttery custard flavor. stronger than our bavarian cream (which has no "Custard" Notes).

*** contains both "Custard" ingredients (acetoin and acetyl propionyl) -

Please see our information section on these ingredients in the Flavorist Corner (lower left of the screen)


****** This flavor should only be used in Food and Cosmetic applications.
****** This flavor (no matter what company makes it) has inhalation risks if it contains either Acetoin or Acetyl Propionyl!

Ingredients: Natural & Artificial Flavors, Propylene Glycol, a small amount of Ethyl Alcohol

The information sheet is here:

shop.perfumersapprentice.com/flavorsworkshop/custard.html

I don't want to open up a can of worms (there is a huge thread on another forum) but even though I love custard vapes it makes me wary.

TPA seem to be very good at stating which flavours are good/not good for vaping though so I feel happier about using their flavours.

[Dan]

Aug 27, 2013 3:23:25 GMT kailey said:

Dan have you seen this:

shop.perfumersapprentice.com/p-7166-vanilla-custard-flavor.aspx

Vanilla Custard Flavor

water soluble

a rich, buttery custard flavor. stronger than our bavarian cream (which has no "Custard" Notes).

*** contains both "Custard" ingredients (acetoin and acetyl propionyl) -

Please see our information section on these ingredients in the Flavorist Corner (lower left of the screen)


****** This flavor should only be used in Food and Cosmetic applications.
****** This flavor (no matter what company makes it) has inhalation risks if it contains either Acetoin or Acetyl Propionyl!

Ingredients: Natural & Artificial Flavors, Propylene Glycol, a small amount of Ethyl Alcohol

The information sheet is here:

shop.perfumersapprentice.com/flavorsworkshop/custard.html

I don't want to open up a can of worms (there is a huge thread on another forum) but even though I love custard vapes it makes me wary.

TPA seem to be very good at stating which flavours are good/not good for vaping though so I feel happier about using their flavours.

I've read it briefly which is why I'm going to be buying tpa custard as opposed to capella.

I love my custard vapes and they are a very big part of me giving up the stinkies in May.. without gvc I would have still been smoking for god knows how long.. the damage caused by minute traces of diacetyl is nothing compared to smoking long term in my opinion.

I've always gone by "honesty is the best policy".. with this in mind i think its fair to say that capella have seriously shot themselves in the foot!!!

From what I gather with regards to perfumers, they have seperated their ranges into perfumers and flavours.. flavours are deemed perfectly safe for vaping and perfumers are not.. if we choose to vape a flavour from the perfumers range we do it at our own risk.. at least they're upfront about their products.. something for capella to take note of me thinks!!

[kailey]

Aug 27, 2013 4:39:14 GMT Dan said:

I've read it briefly which is why I'm going to be buying tpa custard as opposed to capella.

I love my custard vapes and they are a very big part of me giving up the stinkies in May.. without gvc I would have still been smoking for god knows how long.. the damage caused by minute traces of diacetyl is nothing compared to smoking long term in my opinion.

I've always gone by "honesty is the best policy".. with this in mind i think its fair to say that capella have seriously shot themselves in the foot!!!

From what I gather with regards to perfumers, they have seperated their ranges into perfumers and flavours.. flavours are deemed perfectly safe for vaping and perfumers are not.. if we choose to vape a flavour from the perfumers range we do it at our own risk.. at least they're upfront about their products.. something for capella to take note of me thinks!!

Yep, it is how I feel too. I love my custard vapes and it is only a trace. It can't be as bad as smoking 2 packs a day like I did so I still vape custard. Just finished 50ml of GVC and opened my second bottle last night but it still niggles in my mind as I am more or less a chain vaper. I just wanted to make sure you knew before you bought a large quantity of flavouring.

[kurotoshiro]

Aug 27, 2013 4:39:14 GMT Dan said:

From what I gather with regards to perfumers, they have seperated their ranges into perfumers and flavours.. flavours are deemed perfectly safe for vaping and perfumers are not..

This is incorrect. The flavour range includes products (such as vanilla custard) that may contain trace amounts of diacetyl because they contain acetoin and/or acetyl propionyl. The point is that they are the only company who explicitly label which flavours contain acetoin and/or acetyl propionyl.

[oldsmokey]

Is there any independent analysis available to enable you to tell which flavours contain the smallest amount of these potentially toxic substances?

I'm asking because I'm about to embark on my first attempt in DIY mixing. I have been enjoying a large bottle of GVC over the last few days so I think a Vanilla Custard is going to be my starting point. So far I have ordered Capella Vanilla Custard and French Vanilla concentrates (plus some Ethyl Maltol, VG/PG and Nic Base). I'm just wondering if the PA concentrates would be safer long term....

Having said that I'm assuming (dangerously?) that 'trace amounts' should have a minimal health risk. Any thoughts?

[kurotoshiro]

Aug 27, 2013 9:12:38 GMT oldsmokey said:

Is there any independent analysis available to enable you to tell which flavours contain the smallest amount of these potentially toxic substances?

Not as far as I'm aware. Most companies don't say which flavours contain acetoin and/or acetyl propionyl - never mind the quantities. TPA do provide this information, and they also give a rough indication of quantity.

However, the point that TPA emphasise about acetoin and acetyl propionyl is that flavours containing them may also contain trace amounts of diacetyl. In other words, it's probabilistic, not absolute. So I don't think there's any way of inferring the amount of diacetyl present in a liquid given the exact amount of acetoin and/or acetyl propionyl it contains. I'm assuming you'd need to do a batch-by-batch analysis. And some / many / all of those batches may, of course, contain no diacetyl at all.

In any case, as far as I'm aware, there are no serious studies on the long-term effects of regularly vaping diacetyl in trace amounts. I think the only thing a vaper can do is read up on what effects the inhalation of diacetyl has had in other contexts (see the wikipedia page on diacetyl for a good starting place) and make your own judgment about the risks posed by regularly vaping it over the long-term.

Aug 27, 2013 9:12:38 GMT oldsmokey said:

I'm just wondering if the PA concentrates would be safer long term....

I don't think that TPA flavourings which carry a risk of containing diacetyl can be judged any more or less safe than those flavourings of other companies' which carry a risk of containing diacetyl. It's just that TPA are the only company who actually go out of their way to tell you about it.

[oldsmokey]

Thank you kurotoshiro! Time for some research methinks....

[Dan]

Aug 27, 2013 8:54:25 GMT kurotoshiro said:

Aug 27, 2013 4:39:14 GMT Dan said:

From what I gather with regards to perfumers, they have seperated their ranges into perfumers and flavours.. flavours are deemed perfectly safe for vaping and perfumers are not..

This is incorrect. The flavour range includes products (such as vanilla custard) that may contain trace amounts of diacetyl because they contain acetoin and/or acetyl propionyl. The point is that they are the only company who explicitly label which flavours contain acetoin and/or acetyl propionyl.

My apologies

Made an assumption

[Dan]

Ok, had an email back from Carrie, she no longer buy in bulk and so couldn't help.. She did advise to contact Jason @ Vape Escape which I will do in the near future..

Gone a bit silly with the ordering though!

Liberty Flights

Iken 106 1.5ohm atomiser
Flavour Art Banana
Flavour Art Cookie
14 guage needle x 20

Alchemists -

Capella Butter & Lemon Meringue (Couldn't help myself!)
100ml Nic base
10ml Little violets premade (gotta try it!)

28Vapes

Rhubarb
Raspberry
Taffy
English Toffee
Banana Cream
Harvest Berry
TPA VC x 6
Egg Nog
Smooth
Dutch Apple Pie
Sweetener x 2
French Vanilla Deluxe
50ml bottles x 10
5ml syringe x 10

Ebay

3ml syringe x 20
1ml syringe x 20

That'll do for now icon_shoppingm