mybad
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Post by mybad on Oct 22, 2013 22:28:38 GMT
( but any intro to vaping is better than none.) there are many other cheap intro's other than cigalikes. Sorry you have the feeling of confrontation , the heading is after all ( what do YOU think ) Sorry if I misread your posts. I have seen cheaper and better intros than cigalikes but the kind of people who look into e cigs for the first time only ever see the ones in supermarkets or come across some clown selling them in a mall. Exactly .
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Post by dreamylittledream on Oct 22, 2013 22:41:01 GMT
OP is missing context - why exactly would you want to ban cigalikes?
Because generally speaking they are not very good? On that premise maybe we should bad cheap Android tablets as they are a perpetual source of disappointment for those who thing they can get an iPad experience for under 100 notes. Or maybe they are just a consumer offer that should be considered in that light - as in you gets what you pay for.
Or because some manufacturers make misleading claims about equivalence between number of cigs and their products - well this is murky at best given all the stuff we know about nicotine absorption but ultimately you control the advertisers claims rather than get rid of the product.
Or is it because it looks like a cigarette? Well herein lies the rub. Now lets place this is context for a minute - yes as far as I'm concenred vaping equipment is a consumer product - nothing more and nothing less but pretty much its only target market is smokers - and smokers who would ultimately prefer not to be smoking - as in the slowly commiting suicide bit as opposed to anything else. Vaping works well in replacing fags because it does a good emulation of well smoking - some might argue in fact it can and does do things better (not usually in a cigalike form but that's another argument). Now addiction to cigarettes is a complex thing - it has to do with nicotine yes, it has to do with the other multitude of chemicals in smoke, it has a lot to do with the physical action of inhaling and exhaling a vapour and it has a lot to do with habits - some of which are dictated by the form factor. If you want to ease someone off a crutch, the easiest way to do so is to provide a close facsimile to the existing experience - and to some, physiologically the size in their hand is a big thing. Once upon a time it was to me. If you were to show me from four months ago my Vamo and Davide Mega filled with virulent Red Astaire and say that's what you'll be using to smoke instead of a trusty Marlborough Light, I'd have laughed hysterically and then run a mile. It took baby steps and gradual realisation of what my addiction was based on (largely for me the physical action of inhale and exhale I think) to end up where I am now - four months down the line and not a cigarette in my sight or in my thoughts. I wouldn't have got there in one large bounce - there's a lifetime of habits to breakdown first.
I get where the OP might be coming from here, with the prejudice against vaping that is prevalent in society based on the (well lets face it pretty comprehensive) health education drive that has driven smoking from an accepted norm to the habit of pariahs and the lack of logic that follows from a completely non toxic variety being equally ostracised on the grounds that it 'looks like smoking'. But lets get back to basics here for a minute - the purpose of the electric cigarette is to get an end user to stop using something undoubtedly toxic and deadly that they are addicted to and replace it with something that is probably harmless and at worse a lot less toxic and deadly. And given the complex reasons people are addicted to cigarettes in the first place there is a need in the market to have a product that looks like the damned thing to give people who need that initially a place to start from.
I've waffled here so I'll summarise - no cigalikes should not be banned because ultimately there is no logical reason why they should be and if their existence helps one person to stop smoking analogues then their very existence is justified. The rest of the issues with vaping and their perception in society are a side note. Lets recall that bumper sticker eh? Ecigs Save Lives...the end - its a mini adventure.
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silentscream
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Post by silentscream on Oct 22, 2013 22:57:56 GMT
I think if cigalikes were a lot cheaper and the refills didn't equate to equal value compared to cigs it would revolutionise the switch for potential converts. Capitalism of course wins hands down over the greater good in these situations every time.
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Jaguar7777
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Post by Jaguar7777 on Oct 22, 2013 23:03:38 GMT
Ban Them?
Why?
Perhaps we should ban Vaping altogether, after all, it does "Mimic" the use of a Cigarette.
Surely the original question is redundant.
Jag. (Ban this, ban that ... but where does it all end?)
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Post by dreamylittledream on Oct 22, 2013 23:25:55 GMT
Drat - Jag makes my point for me in about an eighth of the number of words I used
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Jaguar7777
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Post by Jaguar7777 on Oct 22, 2013 23:48:02 GMT
Drat - Jag makes my point for me in about an eighth of the number of words I used Indeed ........ But think of the amount of time I'm saving you! Jag. (Quick on the draw .....)
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silentscream
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Post by silentscream on Oct 22, 2013 23:52:20 GMT
Drat - Jag makes my point for me in about an eighth of the number of words I used You made many points, Jag made one
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Jaguar7777
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Post by Jaguar7777 on Oct 22, 2013 23:55:14 GMT
Drat - Jag makes my point for me in about an eighth of the number of words I used You made many points, Jag made one Yes ...... but it was one I made earlier ....... (Had it ready in the oven) Jag. (Be prepared! Odd me saying that. I was never in the Scouts ...)
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lobeydosser
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Post by lobeydosser on Oct 23, 2013 0:00:16 GMT
If we want to get rid of cigalikes because they look like cigarettes, perhaps we should also be looking at getting rid of those MODs that look like a tobacco pipe!
Although I still have the original Skycig pack that got me onto vaping in the first place, I wouldn't be seen dead, using it in public. For the same reason, I won't be buying a pipe-a-like, no matter how good it purports to be.
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giles
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Post by giles on Oct 23, 2013 1:51:13 GMT
The case for banning (or whatever) cig-alikes is that a) they 'normalise' smoking and b) they make it hard to ban smoking in places because those responsible for enforcing the ban can't tell the difference.
That may be the most feeble case for doing anything that you ever heard, but it gets made a lot, to justify banning all e-cigs.
So I think it might not be such a bad idea if they didn't look too much like cigarettes. Maybe legislate that (if cigarette size and shape) they had to be coloured (say) green, with a blue LED. Probably wouldn't stop too many people from trying them, and it might remove a couple of the silly arguments for banning everything.
From the Scunthorpe Council's attempt to ban all ecigs:
Ecigarettes fall outside the scope of the smoke free legislation but some models can, particularly from a distance, look like real cigarettes, making this policy difficult to enforce. This may also create an impression for visitors, customers or other employees that it is acceptable to smoke.
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mybad
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Post by mybad on Oct 23, 2013 11:51:51 GMT
Who came up with word banning cigalikes
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Jaguar7777
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Post by Jaguar7777 on Oct 23, 2013 11:59:46 GMT
Who came up with word banning cigalikes Probably me. Sometimes I like to stir things up a little. I'm sure Chrissie will spank me .... sooner or later ................. Jag. (Headed for the sin bin ....)
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mybad
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Post by mybad on Oct 23, 2013 12:03:06 GMT
Who came up with word banning cigalikes Probably me. Sometimes I like to stir things up a little. I'm sure Chrissie will spank me .... sooner or later ................. Jag. (Headed for the sin bin ....) Little bit of wishful thinking there jag uh .
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GunJack
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Post by GunJack on Oct 23, 2013 12:43:35 GMT
as I mentioned on another thread, my vape-buddy in work discarded ego/ce4 in favour of Halo cig-a-likes, and has done so for the majority of her 13 months smoke-free. If they were not available, maybe she wouldn't have stuck at it. Each to their own in terms of vaping gear
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andy01424
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Post by andy01424 on Oct 23, 2013 12:56:17 GMT
Think turning them away from looking like a replica cig would be a good idea,there was a poll on here re Scunthorpe Council,one of there basis was distinguishing the difference at a distance from the E-cig-Stinkie,so maybe plain coloured ones would be way forward .plus as it was also put by some negatives on ecigs they blamed it drew teenagers in because of it so turning it to plain coloured not looking like cig,white end brown tip,they can then not use that argument
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