Organic E-liquid Vendor Selling Virgin Vapor and Dripeez

[vapegreen]

Greb: i would love to convince you with a sample when we can arrange childproof cap glass bottles in sample size. And yes it is more expensive to extract flavours from real fruits.
Check Spinfuel reviews (one of the Largest Vaping magazines) Virgin Vapor have won the Spinfuel choice award in 2014 and 2013 with several of their flavours.

Risphod: checking your list i think you are confusing organic extraction from real Fruits and Nuts, with oilbased flavours for aroma therapy that some people been known to DIY them self SPECIALLY orange flavours, some vendors have even been know to sell some as DIY flavouring. if that is what you are talking about then YES they are NOT good and should not be Vaped! Should be a fact with all vapers to buy Water based flavours and not oil based anyways. Man you started a long debate with some mixed up information.......

Just to reassure you I have sent you list to both suppliers and will post their reply here.

[Greg]

Jun 3, 2014 21:52:41 GMT vapegreen said:

Greb: i would love to convince you with a sample when we can arrange childproof cap glass bottles in sample size. And yes it is more expensive to extract flavours from real fruits.
Check Spinfuel reviews (one of the Largest Vaping magazines) Virgin Vapor have won the Spinfuel choice award in 2014 and 2013 with several of their flavours.

Risphod: checking your list i think you are confusing organic extraction from real Fruits and Nuts, with oilbased flavours for aroma therapy that some people been known to DIY them self SPECIALLY orange flavours, some vendors have even been know to sell some as DIY flavouring. if that is what you are talking about then YES they are NOT good and should not be Vaped! Should be a fact with all vapers to buy Water based flavours and not oil based anyways. Man you started a long debate with some mixed up information.......

Just to reassure you I have sent you list to both suppliers and will post their reply here.

Convince away my friend   If you struggle with the caps I'd cope with full size 

[Ripshod]

No confusion here. I look forward to hearing their replies

[Mikey@Vaporized]

Greg
I think you may be confusing the flavourings with essential oils. I am a practicing aromatherapist and can say that I doubt very much that there would be dangerous of levels of terpenes found in natural flavourings. There may be trace amounts... but a terpene reacts very readily to heat, air and oxygen. Since the flavours in question are all water based, the breakdown of these compounds would happen rapidly.
Any oil based compound from anything that grows and is extracted through distillation, solvent extraction or expression are done so with preservation of these compounds being a key element.
Limonene will most certainly be found in oil based flavourings, but if at all would be in much lesser amounts in water based flavourings.
I could be wrong as I don't know the exact process for creating the concentrates, but my guess is as well as being water based, the liquid will be pasteurised at some point as well to combine flavours or allow it to bond at a molecular level, thus removing any of these compounds that may remain.
Not saying I have the answer either but definitely worth looking into further. And I would certainly back the notion that anything artificial should not be consumed, ingested or vaped for that matter. When you get into the chemistry of what happens when your organs break these compounds down (or don't in many cases), there are many risks to your health that could arise. I can't afford liquids like that at the moment but, if my funds allowed, I would take my chance with them over cheaply manufactured artificial ingredients in the liquids I am currently using.
Not meaning to debate either, I understand both points of view here, just my two pence worth.
An interesting area to look in to for sure!

[Ripshod]

Definitely. Thanks Mikey@Vaporized, valuable input.

Most of the flavour in ,say a banana, is terpene based. Natural extracts from any plant will contain these terpenes in the form of an oil. Unfortunately the only way to get rid of them is to synthesize a flavour in a chemistry lab. So, we have the choice, and what a tough choice it is. We all have the choice on what we vape, but how many of us know what we're actually vaping, and what is actually contained in there.

The only way open to us to check the science is in the MSDS info. While checking each and every ingredient in these lists (and believe me there's hundreds for every single chemical we know of) is out of the reach of anybody that's not an experienced researcher.

Nothing with a flavour, and claiming to be 100% organic, is without these terpenes. It's unfortunate but true.

I feel a 'Mythbusters' style investigation coming on.

I will say just one more thing. I am not against these juices, never have been. I'm not against any juices. Hell, if I was that concerned I'd vape unflavoured. We just have the right to know what we're inhaling. We've done so much damage over the years with the ciggies we don't really need to do any more. therein lies my reason for supporting regulation of the ingredients used, or at least some proper labling so we can make that choice.

I could have tried making this point in any of the vendors' threads, just unfortunate for vapegreen that this was the one.

Note to mods/admin. If anyone feels what I have said here to be defamatory towards the OP's business, or hear any complaints about what I've posted, please feel free to remove it.

[Mikey@Vaporized]

Ripshod - I have totally overlooked the fact that the e liquid is heated. This means that anything carbon based (all of the components of eliquid) is essentially going through massive changes - 1 compound can be turning in to hundreds through hydrogenisation, polymerisation amongst dozens of other processes that change the atomic structure of the molecules being vaporised.
Hey, it's a toxic world we live in. In reality we don't really know what's in our food, our water, our household products, byproducts from burning fuel that we breathe in every day, our house insulation, even our carpets if you want to go that far. Haha
I say the most important thing is that you know what is in the liquid, where it came from, who made it and how and just apply common sense from there. If we were to spend time analysing every aspect of our lives like this it would be a depressing life to live. In reality nothing is good for us - even the purest of air that keeps us alive is full of free radicals. If you spent enough time worrying about it, you might stop breathing. I certainly know that the amount of chemical compounds produced from vaping must be in to the hundreds. Whether all of them are a bad or not is another question. Most certainly beats a cigarette though.
As for organic liquids being better - no one can really answer this either and you are right it's down to personal choice. My preference would always be natural over artificial. Not because of scientific reasons, just an intuitive feeling.
As I said, common sense is probably the most important thing when buying liquids. Will be interesting to see what vapegreen come back with about this though, I'll be keeping an eye out

[vapegreen]

Ripshod: After checking up on your list I can confirm that most if not all of them are only suitable for making essential oils and similar products and NOT E-liquids.

The recipe that you posted and got warned about was more than likely using an OIL BASED NONE WATER SOLUBLE "flavouring".

Best would be to contact the user that made the Warning in the first place and confirm.

This is a common mistake amongst new DIYers that are buying flavours for the first time.

There are tones of post on various site where people have posted OIL based none water soluble flavours by mistake and been told of by other users.

The Only Flavouring that should be used for E-Liquids are Water soluble Flavours, in fact there was a big warning from POV last month about a Vendor accidentally selling a orange flavour for DIY that was meant for Essential Oils and NOT E-Liquids the vendor even wrote an apology on the POV forum.

To give you a better idea check this list bestvaporflavors.com/best-lorann-oils-vaping/


I think that saying Organic Naturally extracted flavours are dangerous or more dangerous than artificial flavours have been taken out of context. I do not think that this is what you were warned about when you posted your recipe. And I cant find anywhere else on the internet where this claim is made regarding Virgin Vapors flavours or any other naturally flavoured e-liquid makers.

I have also gotten a reply from Virgin Vapor's CEO that reads: There are a lot of amateur scientists out there who like to get everyone in a buzz about something or other that they know very little about. There are thousands of compounds in e-liquid and flavors, organic or otherwise, and the reality is that no long term testing has been done on ANY of them yet or even on vaping in general. We have not tested our products for terepen at this time and so we cannot give any assurances one way or the other. Just to end on a positive note though, we have tested for which most other companies have not: diethylene glycol, heavy metals, MSDS reports on file, currently undergoing certification with AEMSA.

I hope this answers all your questions.