Looky likey rip off

[vapingdaz]

And you know its interesting that you say that Brian. Because another point which I wanted to add is also, I started on a looky likely and went on from there. But in some respect there still has to be a degree of willpower to want to keep vaping. For instance when I ordered my first kit I did a lot of research around it, which interestingly enough I also did back in 2009, while I had tried champix. So do you therefore think that also partly so people fail is due to not being educated enough, and all available options not being accessible for people who want to look at alternatives, that's why I'm kinda glad rusty is putting a leaflet together.

[Anne (fuzzy)]

May 14, 2012 8:30:32 GMT womble said:

Talk to e-lites, they are the ones that made the claim, the vendor is just repeating them.

I wonder if e lites also taught this vendor to tell potential purchasers that PG is just water and turns blue?
It's all very well saying he's not to blame etc., but he didn't even bother to do any homework on e cigs before he started rambling on like a demented parrot.

[Tetsab]

I kind of feel I ought to 'own up' here that ther are some particular reasons why I have such strong feelings about this topic - and such distaste for the methods e-Lites and similar vendors use in their marketing. I have personally met and spoken with many people who have been taken in by misleading claims - and as a result, completely put off the whole idea of e-cigs. On this one, I really DO know what I'm talking about.

I am probably the most microscopically tiny e-cig seller you will ever come across. Once a week I have a stall at my local market where I sell vaping equipment and supplies in person, primarily to people who live in the area. I'm only able to do this part-time as I suffer from depression and simply can't cope with operating on anything like a full-time basis - particularly during the winter, when I also struggle with SAD as well; the medics rather boringly refer to this as "double depression"!

Chrissie and some of the 'old hands' in AAEC are already aware of this - I've discussed it with Chrissie several times as I've never concealed the fact; her most recent ruling regarding my status as 'member' rather than 'supplier' was that unless I wanted to start selling directly to any of the members here was that I could remain as I am, just another member.

As my 'business' is so tiny by comparison with any other vendors you might come across here or anywhere else online, I don't have the ability to buy in the kind of quantities they probably do - I don't buy anything in large numbers and as a result don't get the prices they do, either. As a result, many of my prices are not going to look terribly competitive online to 'educated' vapers - but in truth they were never my 'target market' anyway. (And even so, I still have weeks when I lose money rather than earning any)

I started doing the stall almost three years ago for two primary reasons - the first was to try and make sure that at least one day a week I would be dressed and go out of the house and interact with other people. The other reason was that I was conscious that not all smokers are computer users, so I figured there WAS a gap in the market for me to fit into. In addition, plenty of ripoff cowboy sellers were already gearing up to misleading people and relieving them of too much money for inferior products even then. I wanted to give people the chance to find out about e-cigs without any bullsh*t and also try them out, which you still can't do through a computer screen!

"Cigarette equivalences" have therefore been something I've been nose-first up against for quite some considerable time and they continue to be a thorn in my side to this day. As anyone who has been vaping for a few months will probably agree, they are in fact largely meaningless anyway - certainly from the moment you start refilling anything for yourself, which I've always encouraged people to do, right from the beginning. Refill liquids were on my stall from the first time I set it up - and I still reckon now, just as I did then, lack of refill liquids in any sellers' product line is very telling indeed.

All that aside, the first questions most newcomers ask often start with "how long will...?" so I've become quite expert at explaining that I don't wish to sound evasive in any way, but this WILL vary considerably from one smoker to another. Regardless of whether you are talking about cartridges, cartomisers, atomisers or batteries, the length of time one person will use one for is always different to the next person.

For such a tiny seller I offer a fairly ridiculous range of equipment and of necessity mix quite a lot of my liquids myself (there's no way that I could provide different strengths otherwise, apart from anything else) but I do still have some of the cheapie cig-a-likes, both disposable and rechargeable among my stock. There IS a demand for them - many people really DO want something that looks like a cigarette and will not even consider buying something like an eGo to begin with.

The difference is that I regard these as 'gateway products' and if someone has little money with them and is obviously uncertain, I'll happily suggest they try using one of these to establish for themselves whether they find using one helps them to cut down (or cut out) the number of cigarettes they smoke at minimal cost. If it does, they will feel much more confident about returning to look at arming themselves with something else which may well cost more to start off with but should easily more than pay for itself and possibly provide them with a better vaping experience to boot.

People who come to me by recommendation, having met another of my customers and maybe tried out something totally un-ciggie-like, (a gratifying number of people DO come to me this way) may be happy or even keen to dive in with something else.

Either way, I never feel the slightest need to lie or exaggerate to anyone - if anything, I'd rather underplay it then point out that I'd prefer they were pleasantly surprised than left feeling misled and ripped off. I will be there next week too and I really DO hope to see them again!

You can probably tell that I don't come from a sales background and freely accept that I will probably never get rich doing things the way I do - but money is NOT the only reason why I do this. It would be great simply to earn a modest living and stop paying for my stock on credit cards. I'm not there yet, but I still have hope... (on good days!)

[Anne (fuzzy)]

Honesty is always the best policy, good luck to you Tetsab!

[womble]

May 14, 2012 14:37:29 GMT Anne (fuzzy) said:

May 14, 2012 8:30:32 GMT womble said:

Talk to e-lites, they are the ones that made the claim, the vendor is just repeating them.

I wonder if e lites also taught this vendor to tell potential purchasers that PG is just water and turns blue?
It's all very well saying he's not to blame etc., but he didn't even bother to do any homework on e cigs before he started rambling on like a demented parrot.

To be fair, I was talking about the quoted number of fags it replaced, not the blue water.

And what homework can he do about that? Ask E-lites what they say, that's what, which he obviously did, as he was quoting them (as far as I am aware) word for word.

[Chrissie]

Another excellent post from Tetsab I completely agree with your earlier post about how well this thread has gone. ie everyone feeling they can state their own opinions on the subject & not ending up getting into a fight .

BTW Tetsy, add your market stall location to this thread -

allaboute-cigarettes.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=promoting&action=display&thread=6874&page=1

[womble]

May 14, 2012 16:13:02 GMT vapingdaz said:

May 14, 2012 16:09:58 GMT vapingdaz said:

Can we remember for the purpose of this thread. Hifi did not speak to the elites officials he spoke to a seller, simply a seller.
I can't help but think we are going off the beaten track a little.

I require that hifi did not speak to the directors of e kites, he spoke to a franchisee. Sorry.

I don't think we are going off track at all.

If the franchisee was saying exactly what the E-lites people are saying from their marketing/sales department, then how can he be blamed at all?

The only people you are going to get any answers about it (number of cigs and drags per carto), is from them.



Now, if you're talking about the blue water and the "government won't let us make them any stronger" untruths (I believe it was in the video), then you have to talk to the vendor, as I'm pretty sure they wouldn't come from E-lites, but I could be wrong, there's only one way to find out, ask him.

[vapingdaz]

I have deleted some comments as they don't make sense and tire of this now.

[Gordy]

why are you tired VD this is a very interesting subject

[magicma]

I have met Tetsy and seen her market stall (a while ago now).

She is a most pleasant and patient lady with her buyers. I'm not suprised they frequently return.

If the sun ever shines on a Sunday, maybe I will see you again.

Well done Tets. MMa

[Queenie Bee]

Daz don't feel you need to bow out threads like this are invaluable whether we agree or disagree all angles and ideas can be looked at and many minds are better than one

[Brian]

Yeah Daz. Its because we all have our own thoughts on so many differing topics, and even though they are different, there is hardly any falling out between anyone.

You are entitled to your views, as i and anyone else are allowed ours. We are all adults, and so can engage in various debates without too much provocation, or petty-mindedness.

I LOVE THIS SITE!!!

[vapingdaz]

It is an interesting subject for sure, but when I'm not making sense it bugs me, learned not to update with my phone, always make stupid errors very unprofessional.
What I'm trying to say is womble your comments read as though that guy, that one guy is the whole of e lites, and he isn't he pays them a franchise fee. To represent them and make a living for himself. Now the point I'm making is that that one guy should apparently have had some sort of training, which I don't believe a lot of it is contained in the video. So you can't say about quoting them word for word, because every other seller may not say the same thing.

Would it not be fairer to say that, what this individual is saying to customers, and measure that againstwhat should be being said to consumers. Because they way its worded to me means that e lites are training franchisees, to say that to customers. And we can't say that because we have no evidence.

[Deleted]

This kind of thread bolsters all of us to be positive about the future of e-cigs , informative and also educational , I'm in my second year of vaping and still learn from threads such as this from our more seasoned vapers , if some vendors are acting wrongly in their marketing they need to be brought to book . This can only be done through our forums , ECITA and ECCA .

[vapingdaz]

Yes but storm are the vendors is it them as a whole or just some rogue franchisees, because this is what maddens me about them. Because it casts subject on other good vendors.