Thanks SNP

[Perpetua]

Jul 14, 2015 22:45:32 GMT Bobsbeer said:

Jul 14, 2015 22:37:03 GMT Greg said:

So I'm reading a fox is more important than a dozen chickens that were also torn to shreds and left, interesting views indeed.
Incidentally the fox was hunting down with dogs and guns by the local farmers, I suspect the reason wasn't because of my chickens demise but rather the fear of the loss of their lambs. Different folk have different incentives I guess but the outcome is the same, the fox is no more.
Clearly the farmers view a lamb above a fox too.

Who is saying that?  I live in a rural location, and have no problem with killing animals for food or other reasons, such as pest control. Killing an animal is not the issue with fox hunting. It's not even about the killing of a fox. I totally agree they are not the cuddly, cute, fluffy animals portrayed in many cartoons etc. They are very successful predators, and cause considerable damage to farmed stock or birds.


The issue is how they are killed. We kill sheep, cows and other animals in abattoirs with humane methods, bolt gun, electric shock etc. We don't chase the animal for miles, and then scare it shitless before we kill it. If the problem is so great that foxes need to be controlled, then we have the technology and the intelligence to devise a better way. What it appears we lack is the will, or at least in some circles.

My feeling entirely Bob . . . . if foxes are a problem to farmers, which they are in certain areas - then control them humanely!

Don't dress up the process, glorify it when in reality it's a barbaric method of killing an animal.

I've every sympathy for farmers and their stock does need to be protected - but so does the fox when hunting with hounds is a proposed method of control.

[letsavit]

Don't agree with fox hunting, killing any animal for sport or with any unnecessary fear. Don't agree with the SNP either, you're independent for the Scottish people, so keep it that way.

[charliehorse]

Jul 15, 2015 21:49:28 GMT letsavit said:

Don't agree with fox hunting, killing any animal for sport or with any unnecessary fear. Don't agree with the SNP either, you're independent for the Scottish people, so keep it that way.

I kind of agree with the general sentiment of the post (SNP voting on English only issues) but the vote must have been pretty close before the SNP made their intentions known if it was going to make any difference one way or the other. There are enough Conservative MP's/hunt supporters in Westminster that if they were all going to vote for the issue that the SNP vote would have made no difference ??

"Conservative MPs have been given a free vote on a proposal to relax the law on the use of dogs so that it is the same in England and Wales as in Scotland - but hunting supporters appear unlikely to muster sufficient numbers to win the vote now he SNP has said it will vote against them." Copied from www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-33516713

If it had been the same mix of MP's in Westminster as it was last year, would the bill have gone through uncontested or not ??

And finally ..... EVEL (English votes on English laws) just makes me think of a Bond villain  Could they not think of a better acronym lol  

[letsavit]

Jul 15, 2015 23:00:17 GMT charliehorse said:

Jul 15, 2015 21:49:28 GMT letsavit said:

Don't agree with fox hunting, killing any animal for sport or with any unnecessary fear. Don't agree with the SNP either, you're independent for the Scottish people, so keep it that way.

I kind of agree with the general sentiment of the post (SNP voting on English only issues) but the vote must have been pretty close before the SNP made their intentions known if it was going to make any difference one way or the other. There are enough Conservative MP's/hunt supporters in Westminster that if they were all going to vote for the issue that the SNP vote would have made no difference ??

"Conservative MPs have been given a free vote on a proposal to relax the law on the use of dogs so that it is the same in England and Wales as in Scotland - but hunting supporters appear unlikely to muster sufficient numbers to win the vote now he SNP has said it will vote against them." Copied from www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-33516713

If it had been the same mix of MP's in Westminster as it was last year, would the bill have gone through uncontested or not ??

And finally ..... EVEL (English votes on English laws) just makes me think of a Bond villain  Could they not think of a better acronym lol  

Yea I'm no way supportive of the toffs here, but the SNP save the day bull is not going benefit anyone either and just divide the nation some more. Cameron will just dig his heals in harder and with another 4 years of power, the scots really going benefit from this action? SNP will now tighten the law to two dogs only that can put hours of fear into a fox before they kill it, I'm sure the fox will be most grateful to the SNP. Was this in the SNP manifesto, if so I take it back but what a great one to jump on the Tories with, fox hunting, nice an easy.........political games...

Ha ha we are evil us English...but hey least our leader is not called Putin or poor old Sturgeon would be on the missing list be next week....

[thatguy]

There is definitely something fishy with the SNP (Sturgeon and Salmon(d)). The torys need a dose of reality, life outside Eton, labour need to do what they are meant to do and represent the working people, not the shiftless or those that stuff their coffers, and the lib dems..,who are they again? I forgot.

Mehhh Politiks....leave that topic for the muppets. We is about ECigs, not EVEL!!!

And to reintroduce an old joke.....How to you tell a politician is lying?.....His/her lips are moving!

[gm111]

Jul 14, 2015 21:46:59 GMT Greg said:

The day after a fox has ripped all my chickens apart for fun I'd be more than happy to see the fox receive its just reward in the form of a hound or too.

Secondly i'd never support the SNP, in my view the majority are nationalist bigots. apologies if that offends anyone

Don't you eat chicken? So it's the same us and a fox we need to eat!! I'm not against killing foxes as I go with a friend shooting them but just kill them with no pain and instant death  is different to them getting torn apart,  feeling every limb get torn apart untill about 5 minutes later, just imagine that happening to you, wouldn't be pleasant would it? A bunch of dogs killing a fox is nothing like a fox trying to kill a chicken as the fox will kill the chicken instantly. I know you wouldn't eat your chickens and you've got them for eggs and yes they are defiantly pests but using dogs to kill foxes is animal cruelty, so it would be alright for 2 dogs to fight and one kill the other or 2 cockerels to do the same? It's just not right.. Sorry but if your so worried about a fox getting your chickens put them in a barn or shed like 2 hours before dusk, problem solved

[letsavit]

Jul 16, 2015 0:46:52 GMT thatguy said:

There is definitely something fishy with the SNP (Sturgeon and Salmon(d)). The torys need a dose of reality, life outside Eton, labour need to do what they are meant to do and represent the working people, not the shiftless or those that stuff their coffers, and the lib dems..,who are they again? I forgot.

Yep, in one short paragraph that's pretty much how I see politics today...

[lee]

As for the act of killing anything humanely? Thats a myth there is nothing humane about killing anything? I could rant on & on and ariston about whether a cow feels fear at an abattoir or if a chicken doesnt feel fear when its strung upsidedown next to another that is being ....... well you get my drift.(not for the faint hearted) link

As for the OP politics is fickle, and a professional politician will say anything to stay relevant.

Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies. - Groucho Marx

No offence to anyone, just my 2 pennies worth

[charliehorse]

Jul 15, 2015 23:49:24 GMT letsavit said:

Jul 15, 2015 23:00:17 GMT charliehorse said:

I kind of agree with the general sentiment of the post (SNP voting on English only issues) but the vote must have been pretty close before the SNP made their intentions known if it was going to make any difference one way or the other. There are enough Conservative MP's/hunt supporters in Westminster that if they were all going to vote for the issue that the SNP vote would have made no difference ??

"Conservative MPs have been given a free vote on a proposal to relax the law on the use of dogs so that it is the same in England and Wales as in Scotland - but hunting supporters appear unlikely to muster sufficient numbers to win the vote now he SNP has said it will vote against them." Copied from www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-33516713

If it had been the same mix of MP's in Westminster as it was last year, would the bill have gone through uncontested or not ??

And finally ..... EVEL (English votes on English laws) just makes me think of a Bond villain  Could they not think of a better acronym lol  

Yea I'm no way supportive of the toffs here, but the SNP save the day bull is not going benefit anyone either and just divide the nation some more. Cameron will just dig his heals in harder and with another 4 years of power, the scots really going benefit from this action? SNP will now tighten the law to two dogs only that can put hours of fear into a fox before they kill it, I'm sure the fox will be most grateful to the SNP. Was this in the SNP manifesto, if so I take it back but what a great one to jump on the Tories with, fox hunting, nice an easy.........political games...

Ha ha we are evil us English...but hey least our leader is not called Putin or poor old Sturgeon would be on the missing list be next week....

In 2002, traditional fox hunting was banned in Scotland, ie the pack of hounds chasing down the fox and ripping it apart. The exemption that allowed hunting to continue was allowing them to use packs of hounds to flush foxes to guns, apparently hunts now report that more foxes are being killed using this method.

The SNP are proposing that only two dogs rather than a pack are used to flush the fox out towards waiting guns.

Of course, whether the hunts are actually obeying the law is another topic all together.

I totally agree with the "SNP save the day" line being absolute bull. It's just the way it's being reported and it is the media that tries to stir up the divide the nation crap every chance they get.

Political games will always get played.

[Perpetua]

I am trying hard to avoid passing political comment on this thread, as everyone is entitled to their views - which is something I've always tried to respect in my time, whether I agree or not.

Animal Welfare is my passion - so I would ask if I could, that if anyone is of the same opinion as me that they have some say on this latest Government approved ' project '.

www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/main-topics/general-news/anger-as-government-allows-controversial-yorkshire-beagle-farm-1-7361420

www.animaljusticeproject.com/urgentaction

[letsavit]

Jul 16, 2015 11:16:06 GMT Perpetua said:

I am trying hard to avoid passing political comment on this thread, as everyone is entitled to their views - which is something I've always tried to respect in my time, whether I agree or not.

Animal Welfare is my passion - so I would ask if I could, that if anyone is of the same opinion as me that they have some say on this latest Government approved ' project '.

www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/main-topics/general-news/anger-as-government-allows-controversial-yorkshire-beagle-farm-1-7361420

www.animaljusticeproject.com/urgentaction

That's quite shocking, domestic dogs, never knew that....

[lee]

Jul 16, 2015 11:16:06 GMT Perpetua said:

I am trying hard to avoid passing political comment on this thread, as everyone is entitled to their views - which is something I've always tried to respect in my time, whether I agree or not.

Animal Welfare is my passion - so I would ask if I could, that if anyone is of the same opinion as me that they have some say on this latest Government approved ' project '.

www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/main-topics/general-news/anger-as-government-allows-controversial-yorkshire-beagle-farm-1-7361420

www.animaljusticeproject.com/urgentaction

That is abhorrent & horrific  

[Deleted]

The only reason the SNP got involved in this issue is solely down to Westminster sticking their noses into our affairs! Again the English media put their own spin on it, your Gov( again that we did not vote for) has constantly lied, deceived and even tried to convince the electorate that some how Nicola Sturgeon had said to a French Minister she would rather a Tory Governement, and we all know the truth on that one!

And for a totally independent view on this I was born in North London and moved to the Highlands some 37 yrs ago!

[lee]

Jul 16, 2015 12:35:13 GMT car147 said:

The only reason the SNP got involved in this issue is solely down to Westminster sticking their noses into our affairs! Again the English media put their own spin on it, your Gov( again that we did not vote for) has constantly lied, deceived and even tried to convince the electorate that some how Nicola Stugeon had said to a French Minister she would rather a Tory Governement, and we all know the truth on that one!

And for a totally independent view on this I was born in North London and moved to the Highlands some 37 yrs ago!

Glad thats sorted then car147 (aged 38) Only joking matey you would have seen my previous post anyways 

[Deleted]

54 m8