None TPD Compliant Tanks

[Perpetua]

May 9, 2017 5:09:34 GMT Tomo said:

With doomsday approaching was wondering if it will have any consequences for this forum. What would happen if one of the vendors on this forum advertised a non TPD compliant tank or e liquid after May 20th?

We do only approve Vendors who abide by Consumer Contract Regulations as it shows professionalism and responsibility among other things, so it would be hoped that our Vendors will be equally respectful with regards to the TPD to spare us all the awkwardness of any potential situations.

 

May 9, 2017 5:09:34 GMT Tomo said:

Is the forum responsible for policing these adverts or is it the buyers responsibility not to buy?

It's not something we've discussed in all honesty Tomo, the TPD fills us with as much gloom as it does everyone else.

But there it is, soon to be law and the T&C's for using Proboards do state that we also have a responsibility for ensuring laws of the land are adhered to.

This is unknown, uncharted territory so we'll take instances as when, if they do arise I would imagine.

Chrissie, snow . . . . would you have further thoughts on this?

[thebishman]

Well i reckon this corner of the net should be a tpd free zone lol

[bioxx]

May 9, 2017 6:08:18 GMT thebishman said:

Well i reckon this corner of the net should be a tpd free zone lol

Would be great if this were possible but don't we all love laws and regulations or am I the only one

I don't think vendors will advertise non compliant stuff here, only getting themselves and us in trouble.

[thebishman]

May 9, 2017 6:59:38 GMT bioxx said:

May 9, 2017 6:08:18 GMT thebishman said:

Well i reckon this corner of the net should be a tpd free zone lol

Would be great if this were possible but don't we all love laws and regulations or am I the only one

I don't think vendors will advertise non compliant stuff here, only getting themselves and us in trouble.

Yeah i know. Was tongue in cheek

[smokingaces]

As far as I know aaec is a Forum with members all over the world, the TPD only cover countries in the E.U so vendors could still advertise here for countries that are not effected by the TPD.

[jtc]

God help us

[smokingaces]

May 9, 2017 8:43:01 GMT jtc said:

God help us

In a Year times all our old tanks bigger than 2ml will be worth a fortune, thats what I tell myself every time I buy one now lol

[Richard46]

May 9, 2017 8:40:24 GMT smokingaces said:

As far as I know aaec is a Forum with members all over the world, the TPD only cover countries in the E.U so vendors could still advertise here for countries that are not effected by the TPD.

That sounds like it makes sense but then I am not responsible for the forum.

About buyers being responsible as mentioned earlier. I have read the regs and I cannot see anything about buying at all. It is selling that will be illegal. Buying something that it is not illegal to buy and will still be legal to possess from someone who has sold it in contravention of the law is an interesting one. Aiding & abetting a contravention of the regulations perhaps?
I am trying to think of an equivalent 'banned' but not 'banned' product? 

[smokingaces]

May 9, 2017 9:28:33 GMT Richard46 said:

May 9, 2017 8:40:24 GMT smokingaces said:

As far as I know aaec is a Forum with members all over the world, the TPD only cover countries in the E.U so vendors could still advertise here for countries that are not effected by the TPD.

That sounds like it makes sense but then I am not responsible for the forum.

About buyers being responsible as mentioned earlier. I have read the regs and I cannot see anything about buying at all. It is selling that will be illegal. Buying something that it is not illegal to buy and will still be legal to possess from someone who has sold it in contravention of the law is an interesting one. Aiding & abetting a contravention of the regulations perhaps?
I am trying to think of an equivalent 'banned' but not 'banned' product? 

As far as I know TPD only cover business too so I could sell my 5ml tank as a private vendor as I am not a business. Always thought the 2ml tank was beyond a joke like the new warning sign on coils tanks & mods when you purchase these they have no nicotine in them so why have a warning sign. After all some of the mods are like glorified paper weights these days lol

[snow]

May 9, 2017 9:39:52 GMT smokingaces said:

May 9, 2017 9:28:33 GMT Richard46 said:

That sounds like it makes sense but then I am not responsible for the forum.

About buyers being responsible as mentioned earlier. I have read the regs and I cannot see anything about buying at all. It is selling that will be illegal. Buying something that it is not illegal to buy and will still be legal to possess from someone who has sold it in contravention of the law is an interesting one. Aiding & abetting a contravention of the regulations perhaps?
I am trying to think of an equivalent 'banned' but not 'banned' product? 

As far as I know TPD only cover business too so I could sell my 5ml tank as a private vendor as I am not a business. Always thought the 2ml tank was beyond a joke like the new warning sign on coils tanks & mods when you purchase these they have no nicotine in them so why have a warning sign. After all some of the mods are like glorified paper weights these days lol

I think thats an interesting thought and something which needs clarification - I thought the regulations covered all sales not just business related sales. It would be nice if it didn't but I have a feeling they would have taken care of that 

I do feel that given the forum isn't hosted on UK servers and we do indeed cater to many members who don't live in the UK or EU we're still OK with the Chinese vendors and non EU vendors listing non compliant stuff here. I think though that EU/UK vendors can't sell non compliant goods to anyone even those outside UK/EU?  Not sure and again we need some clarification on that. 

[striker42]

Just one of many instances you have highlighted smokingaces, where this TPD carry on falls on its arse for me. Richard46, you've given the law and your take on it, but again, nothing concrete, so it all comes down to interpretation. My biggest concern for the forum is that if non compliant goods are advertised for sale, AAEC is viewed as a platform for trading in illegal goods, the Admins are held responsible and the forum is axed. To be able to sell a tank, a member would need to know if it was compliant, so therefore we would need to be supplied with a list of what is compliant to work off. Likewise, with juice. Because a tank is max 2ml or juice is max 10ml volume and no more than 20mg nicotine doesn't mean they are automatically compliant, as most of us know. I'm sure there will be a song and dance made out of the first few prosecutions for for those who fall foul of the TPD.

[smokingaces]

May 9, 2017 10:07:47 GMT snow said:

May 9, 2017 9:39:52 GMT smokingaces said:

As far as I know TPD only cover business too so I could sell my 5ml tank as a private vendor as I am not a business. Always thought the 2ml tank was beyond a joke like the new warning sign on coils tanks & mods when you purchase these they have no nicotine in them so why have a warning sign. After all some of the mods are like glorified paper weights these days lol

I think thats an interesting thought and something which needs clarification - I thought the regulations covered all sales not just business related sales. It would be nice if it didn't but I have a feeling they would have taken care of that 

I do feel that given the forum isn't hosted on UK servers and we do indeed cater to many members who don't live in the UK or EU we're still OK with the Chinese vendors and non EU vendors listing non compliant stuff here. I think though that EU/UK vendors can't sell non compliant goods to anyone even those outside UK/EU?  Not sure and again we need some clarification on that. 

Uk vendors can definability sell non TPD compliant stock outside counties that are not being tied too the TPD, same as some big distributors in the UK, have deals with Russian vape companies. Most Uk vendors will just stick too the rules, as they don't want too get slapped with fines for the pennies they would make. I will get clarification on the private sales part.

[Richard46]

May 9, 2017 10:07:47 GMT snow said:

May 9, 2017 9:39:52 GMT smokingaces said:

As far as I know TPD only cover business too so I could sell my 5ml tank as a private vendor as I am not a business. Always thought the 2ml tank was beyond a joke like the new warning sign on coils tanks & mods when you purchase these they have no nicotine in them so why have a warning sign. After all some of the mods are like glorified paper weights these days lol

I think thats an interesting thought and something which needs clarification - I thought the regulations covered all sales not just business related sales. It would be nice if it didn't but I have a feeling they would have taken care of that 

I do feel that given the forum isn't hosted on UK servers and we do indeed cater to many members who don't live in the UK or EU we're still OK with the Chinese vendors and non EU vendors listing non compliant stuff here. I think though that EU/UK vendors can't sell non compliant goods to anyone even those outside UK/EU?  Not sure and again we need some clarification on that. 

My reading of the regs is the same the sections on sales refer to 'persons' i.e. anyone. Could be read that even second hand sales of non-compliant stuff is illegal. If the authorities are going to hunt down the 'odd' hobbyist is another matter but I suspect legally they could. snow I think your interpretation is correct and this is not something where chances can be taken.

[striker42]

As a side note in all this. Not so many weeks back, Gary Dibley posted on a faceache group (I know, but you can sometimes pick up good information) that at that moment in time NOTHING was yet TPD compliant, only that notification was given and applications made, but no certification had been issued for anything. Which leads me to pose the question. Will vendors show product certification on their website or will we be expected to take their word for it when a product has "TPD compliant" in the description ? I understand that the onus is on the vendor, but excuse me for thinking that somewhere along the line, the powers that be will quite happily try and take the consumer to task along the way.

[Richard46]

May 9, 2017 10:55:28 GMT striker42 said:

As a side note in all this. Not so many weeks back, Gary Dibley posted on a faceache group (I know, but you can sometimes pick up good information) that at that moment in time NOTHING was yet TPD compliant, only that notification was given and applications made, but no certification had been issued for anything. Which leads me to pose the question. Will vendors show product certification on their website or will we be expected to take their word for it when a product has "TPD compliant" in the description ? I understand that the onus is on the vendor, but excuse me for thinking that somewhere along the line, the powers that be will quite happily try and take the consumer to task along the way.

Anything is possible but under the TPD I don't see how. Consumers are not mentioned in the TPD. Perhaps a comparision with car emission standards is relevant. i.e. I have a Skoda that it has now been discovered was sold to me new but did not meet the legal standard. There has been no suggestion that all us VW/Skoda/SEAT owners are responsible in any way however. It is the supplier who is responsible for what they sell.

Just my take on it of course.