MrDJ
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Post by MrDJ on Mar 22, 2024 11:22:56 GMT
Im not sure Perpetua i asked the same question on the planet. If i hear anything concrete about private forums then ill report back.
The owner of the forum did post this: We ARE counted as a specialist site and don’t come under social media if that helps. I think their primary concern has been TikTok and that where most recent violations have come from.
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MrDJ
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Post by MrDJ on Mar 21, 2024 18:16:46 GMT
And so it begins.... Thanks to Vape Potions for the link.
Enforcement After 28 March 2024, we will be deploying the ASA’s AI-based Active Ad Monitoring system to actively scan for social media accounts that breach this Enforcement Notice. This may result in sanctions, including the removal of content and social media accounts.
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MrDJ
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Post by MrDJ on Mar 12, 2024 18:32:38 GMT
The Chancellor’s vape tax is wrong in principle and childlike in application It is difficult to know where to start describing the fundamental flaws behind the new vape tax proposal announced in last week’s budget.
UNDERMINES THE GOVERNMENT’S SWAP TO STOP CAMPAIGN
There is a complete lack of joined-up thinking in the government spending tax receipts on encouraging smokers to quit by handing out one million free vapes, only to then disincentivise those who take up the offer by applying heavy duties to the liquids they need to actually use them. The proposed framework reveals these clear informational problems across government and a fundamental misunderstanding of the realities of vaping.
MISUNDERSTANDS SCIENCE The government seems preoccupied by what the nicotine liquid equivalent of a cigarette is, whereas it is irrelevant how much nicotine a vape contains compared with nicotine in a cigarette because the products are completely different. Nicotine is not the element that causes the death and disease, it is the combustion. As Action on Smoking and Health explains, “puffs on vapes ARE NOT equivalent to puffs on cigarettes.”
CHILD-LIKE ASSUMPTIONS
To say the proposals are ill thought-out would be an understatement. The public should expect its government to investigate a policy area comprehensively before proposing punitive taxation which imposes significant costs on people who have quit smoking exactly as they have been encouraged to do by the NHS. It has not been done in this case.
Instead, the documents published to back up the imposition of a new vape tax are notable for being almost childlike. There is a non-existent appreciation of the difference between content, consumption, and absorption of nicotine.
IPSOS POLL CLAIM HAS NO FOUNDATION
For example, an IPSOS poll commissioned in November but only published on the day of the budget announcement makes the claim that “The average (mean) strength of nicotine used amongst current vapers was reported to be 10mg per ml (just under the strength of a typical cigarette).”
This definition has never been used before; it is not recognised in any literature on the subject. Indeed, the Tobacco and Related Products Regulations (2016) (TRPR) is the mechanism by which the government transposed regulations from the EU’s Tobacco Products Directive (2014) (TPD) into UK law.
Article 18 of the TPD states that, “[n]icotine-containing liquid should only be allowed to be placed on the market under this Directive, where the nicotine concentration does not exceed 20 mg/ml. This concentration allows for a delivery of nicotine that is comparable to the permitted dose of nicotine derived from a standard cigarette during the time needed to smoke such a cigarette.”
The maximum nicotine limit allowed in vaping liquids in the UK is set at 20mg/ml, to precisely align with the EU’s definition of what they consider to be equivalent for one cigarette. Yet IPSOS has conjured up an entirely new level and does not cite any source for it.
The best we can assume as to how this level was decided is that cigarettes are limited to 12mg of nicotine content and so that is what they have gone with. It is the simplistic thinking you would expect from an increasingly misinformed public rather than a government department, but this ignorant interpretation has been accepted without question.
The EU’s definition itself was flawed by comparing what comes out of a cigarette with what goes in to an e-cigarette. They based their crude assessment on a study in 2014 which discussed nicotine absorption, the author of which wrote to the EU to complain that they had misrepresented his research and that “20 mg/ml e-liquid provides less than one-third of the nicotine delivered by one tobacco cigarette.”
THE TAX ON VAPING PUNISHES QUITTING MORE HARSHLY THAN CONTINUING TO SMOKE
So, we now have government legislating to apply a tax on vaping liquid at least six times harsher than they do for cigarettes.
Best estimate from that research was that nicotine absorption after smoking for 5 minutes is between 185% and 286% higher than the vaping devices tested after 5 minutes. There is no recognition of that science in the government’s facile justification of the vape tax. Applying duty on the contents of vape liquids and cigarettes, rather than the absorption of the products, is scientifically and morally illiterate.
In his speech, Jeremy Hunt claimed that: “Because vapes can also play a positive role in helping people quit smoking, we will introduce a one-off increase in tobacco duty at the same time to maintain the financial incentive to choose vaping over smoking.”
He has done nothing of the sort. The public consultation document released alongside the budget announcement states that users of stronger liquids (≥11mg/ml) will face a 143% price increase. Weaker liquids (<11mg/ml) will go up by 98%, and nicotine-free liquids by 48%.
The increase in combustible tobacco duty, by comparison, is around 2.5%. To put that into context. As a result of the budget, a 20 per day smoker will take 21 days to pay the extra duty that a standard vaper using 20mg/ml liquid will pay in 7 days. The Chancellor has considerably reduced the financial differential between smoking and vaping.
THE SMOKEFREE 2030 GOAL WILL BE UNATTAINABLE
The only result of this will be a significant deterrent to smokers who are considering switching to vaping, an increase in sales of illicit products, and relapse by many back to smoking cigarettes. The government’s Smokefree 2030 target is now effectively dead.
The Chancellor’s announcement cloaks itself as a health policy, and yet it shows no sign that anyone with any knowledge of smoking, vaping, nicotine or health has been consulted in its design.
The government seems overly concerned about nicotine addiction, without any appreciation that it is an entirely different thing to harm. Even if that is the case, the proposal to tax non-nicotine products which, by definition, cannot be addictive makes no sense at all.
The consultation document claims that one purpose of the tax is to “encourage consumers to choose lower strength or nicotine-free vaping products over higher strength ones due to the harms from nicotine addiction.”
This is so absurd as to be laughable. People using lower strengths use higher volumes to take in the nicotine they want. Higher volumes mean more energy and potentially more exposure to contaminants and thermal decomposition products. The government’s infantile understanding of the policy area and obsession with nicotine (which is not the harmful element of combustible tobacco use) is driving consumers to increase potential harm. Those drafting the documents could have avoided such a schoolboy error by Googling “nicotine titration” because it is clear they have never heard of it.
THE GOVERNMENT’S STRATEGY WILL COST LIVES
It is doubly counterproductive because stronger liquids will tend to be those used by people starting to vape who will now be punished at the highest level. Higher strength liquids will also be used long-term by people with poor mental health to stay off cigarettes – or at least they would have done without this new interference in what showed promise in saving the lives of people with mental health issues. The Chancellor’s insistence that “vapes can also play a positive role in helping people quit smoking” is shown to be hollow when he has erected the greatest financial barrier to the products which can most effectively play that positive role. This, after the government has also vowed to ban single use vapes which have led to the most significant declines in smoking prevalence ever seen in this country, and despite pleas from public health organisations not to do so.
SUBMIT TO THE CONSULTATION
These mistakes could have been avoided if the government consulted industry and consumer representatives who could have quickly pointed out the flaws. However, it has not done so, instead cobbling together an incoherent mess of proposals which can only do harm.
Despite the proposals – and the consultation document - being puerile, naïve and incredibly shallow, the NNA would strongly suggest that all our supporters, consumers, and others who understand harm reduction better than the government’s woeful attempt, make a submission.
Many have suggested that the Chancellor has proposed this tax purely as a cynical tax grab. We will be charitable and hope it is a genuine mistake driven by bad advice and a lack of understanding rather than prioritising revenue generation to gain election votes over public health.
With your help, maybe we can highlight to government that these comical set of proposals are an embarrassment and should be revisited. The NNA will be submitting a comprehensive consultation response in due course and will guide our followers to do the same.
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MrDJ
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Post by MrDJ on Mar 6, 2024 21:38:39 GMT
The duty will apply to liquids for use in vaping devices and e-cigarettes at the following rates: £1 per 10ml for nicotine free liquids £2 per 10ml for liquid containing nicotine at concentrations between 0.1 to 10.9mg per ml £3 per 10ml for liquids containing nicotine at concentrations 11mg per ml, or above
So for instance
100ml zero nic shortfill £10 + £10 tax + £6 for 2 nic shots = £26 for 100ml
100ml premium juice £19.99 + £10 + £6 for 2 nic shots = £35.99
edit
just been corrected You need to add VAT to the duty, so total = £29.20 (for £10 100ml shortfil + 2 nicshots).
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MrDJ
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Post by MrDJ on Mar 5, 2024 16:21:33 GMT
The petition has reached 40,108 signatures, still a long way to go to hit the 100k+ I wish more vendors would promote it to their lists..... congrats though to ELFC for adding to one of their email circulars. ^EXACTLY.
from your post i decided to check all my recommended suppliers on the Planet.
Out of 138 suppliers on my list only 14 had any sign of a banner scrolling advert or blog post.
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MrDJ
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Post by MrDJ on Feb 15, 2024 21:35:30 GMT
Thanks to all who signed. not bad, 9200 in 1 day. only another 90,000 to go.
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MrDJ
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Post by MrDJ on Feb 14, 2024 21:53:20 GMT
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MrDJ
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Post by MrDJ on Feb 14, 2024 20:34:38 GMT
your not the only one gill2009 hopefully 5 litres of custard should last me a few years.
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MrDJ
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Post by MrDJ on Feb 14, 2024 12:02:44 GMT
Posting Vics video here as well so more people can see it.
Shorfills, longfills, one shots 0 nicotine bottles to be classed the same as 10ml nicotine vape juice.
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MrDJ
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Post by MrDJ on Feb 14, 2024 11:50:42 GMT
here we go again. looks like the loophole of shortfills will get included in this ban i bet Stanton Glanz is smiling like a cheshire cat.
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MrDJ
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Post by MrDJ on Jan 11, 2024 22:09:50 GMT
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MrDJ
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Post by MrDJ on Dec 24, 2023 11:57:29 GMT
Happy Christmas one and all.
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MrDJ
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Post by MrDJ on Oct 15, 2023 19:20:45 GMT
yup. theve miised lots of options out but just tick dont know then fill the box out explaing what you want to say. some of it is total crap. option of should fines be given to those that sell to children with options of £100 or £200 i said £5000 first offence and doubled if caught again and then licence removed from selling and not just vape, they need a warning so i said lose licence for selling lottery tickets and even fags and booze. they will soon think twice if theres a rish they are going to lose their licence. also said ban popup shops like the phone cases and vape. they are the ones that are causing the problems and only give licence to dedicated vape shops where kids are not allowed in. still doesnt solve the black market tossers though so trading standards need more funding to do more raids.
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MrDJ
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Post by MrDJ on Oct 15, 2023 9:57:58 GMT
Creating a smokefree generation and tackling youth vaping: your views
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MrDJ
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Post by MrDJ on Aug 28, 2023 10:46:40 GMT
Hi there guys I have been using the Aspire Cleito tank for quite a while now and the stock mouthpieces are pretty much knackered due to my clumsiness and dropping my devices numerous times. Has anyone got any idea on what sort of mouthpiece would fit the tank and where I would be able to get some from as obviously Fasttech (where I would normally get spares from) has now closed. Wishing you all a great Bank Holiday is it just the mouthpiece your after ot the whole screw in top.
not sure which you get though as its a little misleading, Cleito/Atlantis-EVO Short/Big POM Single
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