Flavouring compositions

[Ancient Hermit]

I was just thinking we could use some notes on flavours we are all using and what they are made up from. I am having the toughest time looking up potential new flavours and finding out what they contain.

Now this is fine for the makers and the sellers as it leaves a newbie in the position of buying some to find out and maybe not even finding out if they did buy it if the label is poor in information content!

All I would like is a glimpse of the label; then I'd be allowed to know if it's PG or VG or both and perhaps whether it's got tank cracking potential. Unless of course they don't feel inclined to share any information, and if that were so then I'd not feel inclined to support that business model by buying some as I'd have no way to get any idea where I stand with that product would I? At least not enough to make any kind of informed purchase decision. (sorry if that sounds a tiny bit grumpy, but getting it right costs a little sometimes!)

So I was thinking why not all of us spend a moment or two as we go along, and post an image of that label, or type up what it says.

ok, it would need keeping up to date, as I am sure recipes change from time to time, but over time it could become a priceless resource to mixers, and save all of us much time and trouble while researching a new mix prior to jumping in and buying some.

As a group we could choose to be solidly constructive and mutually supportive in that way! 

[Jen]

Not sure what you're getting at...my flavourings usually just come with a label stating the brand name and flavour name, occasionally with instructions for storage. It's generally the case that flavourings are PG unless otherwise stated. As for ingredients in flavourings, you'd need to ask the manufacturer. I think there are some docs floating around somewhere with manufacturing info, Kev at Alchemist's Cupboard has done some sterling work on that front IIRC. There's also a list of known tank crackers around too.

Is that the sort of thing you're after?

[fred]

Have a look here.

Most flavours I believe, are PG based.

If you look through the recipes in the Mixology board, it will specify the brand of flavours needed. Once you have mixed a few of them, you will have a good feeling for them and your personal preferences.

[Ancient Hermit]

Jul 17, 2013 10:23:29 GMT Jen said:

Not sure what you're getting at...my flavourings usually just come with a label stating the brand name and flavour name, occasionally with instructions for storage. It's generally the case that flavourings are PG unless otherwise stated. As for ingredients in flavourings, you'd need to ask the manufacturer. I think there are some docs floating around somewhere with manufacturing info, Kev at Alchemist's Cupboard has done some sterling work on that front IIRC. There's also a list of known tank crackers around too.

Is that the sort of thing you're after?

No, not really; the quest was triggered by the fact that the calculators ask us what pg/vg a given flavour has, and so we need to know this as we all rather depend on these calcs, and they in turn depend on having the info fed in to them.

It seemed like a glaring omission that we potentially had no hard info to type in if we were attempting to make a potential new recipe.

I would imagine the labels should at least mention that little (how else to obtain the numbers to put into the calcs?), but I don't have any flavours yet so can't look at one to see, and therefore can't even get started with making a proper potential recipe, never mind buying the flavours for it.

It is conceivable that certain mixes can not actually be made, and so it would be good to have the calculator tell us this in advance of making an ultimately pointless purchase.

If you knew a recipe was viable then you'd presumably be in good shape to buy in ingredients and set about making the mix based upon it.

[Jen]

So you're talking PG/VG ratios? Just put all your flavourings in as PG (as they generally are), and the calculator will do the rest for you. But then, obviously, you will always have the percentage of flavouring you use (say 20%) as PG in every mix.

Me, I just input them all as VG and go for 100% VG, even though I'm aware this isn't true, but I'm not that fussy and it saves messing

I do agree that flavourings should have a little more info on the label though.

[Ancient Hermit]

Jul 17, 2013 10:32:56 GMT fred said:

Have a look here.

Most flavours I believe, are PG based.

If you look through the recipes in the Mixology board, it will specify the brand of flavours needed. Once you have mixed a few of them, you will have a good feeling for them and your personal preferences.

Now that link takes me to something truly beyond my wildest dreams or expectations!

Armed with that one would be able to adequately fill out the calculators questions with some confidence!

Now if they could do it then so could any other maker! So, guess who's flavours I'll be considering top of my shopping list then! LOL 

By properly supporting us like that then they enable us to support them because we are able to make an informed purchase decision, and that is to their advantage.

[Perpetua]

I do as Jen does . . . all for keeping mixing simple me.

You'll maybe find the actual Flavouring Houses home websites have the detailed information you're perhaps looking for Ancient, if you really want to spend time pursuing it that far.

Like the The Perfumer's Apprentice:

shop.perfumersapprentice.com/

[Roger]

Jul 17, 2013 11:47:04 GMT Ancient Hermit said:

Jul 17, 2013 10:32:56 GMT fred said:

Have a look here.

Most flavours I believe, are PG based.

If you look through the recipes in the Mixology board, it will specify the brand of flavours needed. Once you have mixed a few of them, you will have a good feeling for them and your personal preferences.

Now that link takes me to something truly beyond my wildest dreams or expectations!

Armed with that one would be able to adequately fill out the calculators questions with some confidence!

Now if they could do it then so could any other maker! So, guess who's flavours I'll be considering top of my shopping list then! LOL 

By properly supporting us like that then they enable us to support them because we are able to make an informed purchase decision, and that is to their advantage.

You really are bending over backwards to make life difficult aren't you?   The calculators does not ask difficult questions, Jen has already told you that most flavourings are carried in PG, that is all you need to know really.  Any % given is only a guide, as different folk will prefer different %    

[Ancient Hermit]

ok, well I was just wanting to know how to get the right answers in the right places. I have found that many vendors have PG only left in stock and was trying to make the best of a bad situation. Was hoping to eek a few more percentage points in my favour.

I don't like PG as much as VG and sadly I can't even get a 30/70 to work in the calcs. I also read that some makers are starting to make the flavour with VG too. Maybe there will be hope if/when more of that happens.

Sorry for making life difficult, it was not my intention at all.

[Roger]

Jul 17, 2013 15:16:11 GMT Ancient Hermit said:

ok, well I was just wanting to know how to get the right answers in the right places. I have found that many vendors have PG only left in stock and was trying to make the best of a bad situation. Was hoping to eek a few more percentage points in my favour.

I don't like PG as much as VG and sadly I can't even get a 30/70 to work in the calcs. I also read that some makers are starting to make the flavour with VG too. Maybe there will be hope if/when more of that happens.

Sorry for making life difficult, it was not my intention at all.

If EJMU tells you that you can't do a mix at a certain ratio, that is because you can't, not the calc being awkward.  alchemists cupboard sells nic base in VG, so does cig-eliquid.  With a VG base you can do 30/70 easy peasy, even 20/80.  You won't get much better than that unless you can find vg flavours, or tell ejmu that they are VG. 

[Jen]

You'd need to input something like this for a 30/70:




EDIT: Or something like that without the error at the top! Just enter whatever your nic base is instead.

[Jen]

A better example:

[Ancient Hermit]

Jul 17, 2013 15:25:57 GMT Roger said:

Jul 17, 2013 15:16:11 GMT Ancient Hermit said:

ok, well I was just wanting to know how to get the right answers in the right places. I have found that many vendors have PG only left in stock and was trying to make the best of a bad situation. Was hoping to eek a few more percentage points in my favour.

I don't like PG as much as VG and sadly I can't even get a 30/70 to work in the calcs. I also read that some makers are starting to make the flavour with VG too. Maybe there will be hope if/when more of that happens.

Sorry for making life difficult, it was not my intention at all.

If EJMU tells you that you can't do a mix at a certain ratio, that is because you can't, not the calc being awkward.  alchemists cupboard sells nic base in VG, so does cig-eliquid.  With a VG base you can do 30/70 easy peasy, even 20/80.  You won't get much better than that unless you can find vg flavours, or tell ejmu that they are VG. 

Thanks very much for that tip, I shall have to grab it from there, and although the prices are a bit more, it is 72mg and so could go further. I guess it's all a bit swings and roundabouts.