best value for money juices - cost and quality

[xs2man]

You don't really need to get a proper starter kit really. Do you have empty bottles from previous flavours? Just wash them out and use them, while you wait on fesh ones from Fasttech (https://www.fasttech.com/products/1411/10006152/1485901).

Then nip to Boots and pick up a 1ml, 5ml and 10ml syringes along with a bottle of their value glycol (this is your VG, and you can water it down with vodka / deionised water at 15-20%). There is already a link above to pretty much the best deal on nic base around, so I won't bother to link you to that, but you can either get your PG there, or here : www.ebay.co.uk/itm/130853413769?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649 (much cheaper, but a huge amount). Then all you need is your concentrate. So a 30ml bottle or two from T-Juice and your good to start.

As for why you need both PG and VG dilutants, well, it depends on what your mixing, what strength, what ratio and how strong your nic base is. But in general, I like to mix with a PG nic base at 72mg, to s strength of 18mg with 20% flavouring (for RA for example), with a 60/40 PG/VG ratio. So for a 10ml mix I use:

2.5ml Nic Base (25%)
1.5ml PG (15%)
4ml VG (40%)
2ml Flavouring (20%)

This gives me the perfect ratio, for me.  And in fact, assuming I just change the flavouring, and it is always 20% concentrate I use, the rest of the base stays the same, so when I'm mixing multiple flavours, I always mix the Nic base / PG / VG up first, in multiple bottles, then add flavours to each bottle depending on what I'm making.

[clivealive1]

geting there but :
to make 10ml at 12mg Nic 70/30
Nicotine Base Liquid 36mg ML drops %
(96.4/3.6 PG/VG) drops/ml 3.33 100 33.33
PG (Propylene Glycol) drops/ml 2.04 61 20.37
VG (Vegetable Glycerine) drops/ml 2.13 64 21.3
Red Astaire (0/0 PG/VG) drops/ml 2.5 75 25

so looked easy until i added red astaire and this changed the amounts shown (i know mathmatically it would)
but assuming the red astaire has no pg vg this lessens the amount of pg/vg added and so does it still work right ?

used calculator

[xs2man]

I think RA is a PG concentrate. So that counts towards your PG value. So...

3.33ml Nic base
1.67ml PG
3ml VG
2ml RA

I use the eJuice Me Up calculator, as I find it pretty easy to work with, and it means I don't need another open tab in my browser, lol.

[clivealive1]

hmm i doesnt say any pg/vg details on the T-juice site for RA, not that i could see anyways. so its 100% pg ?
may take another look

[boyofford]

Dec 31, 2013 11:23:07 GMT clivealive1 said:

hmm i doesnt say any pg/vg details on the T-juice site for RA, not that i could see anyways. so its 100% pg ?
may take another look

Can't remember where I read it but pretty sure it is 80:20 PG:VG

[boyofford]

Dec 31, 2013 11:03:02 GMT clivealive1 said:

geting there but :
to make 10ml at 12mg Nic 70/30
Nicotine Base Liquid 36mg ML drops %
(96.4/3.6 PG/VG) drops/ml 3.33 100 33.33
PG (Propylene Glycol) drops/ml 2.04 61 20.37
VG (Vegetable Glycerine) drops/ml 2.13 64 21.3
Red Astaire (0/0 PG/VG) drops/ml 2.5 75 25

so looked easy until i added red astaire and this changed the amounts shown (i know mathmatically it would)
but assuming the red astaire has no pg vg this lessens the amount of pg/vg added and so does it still work right ?

used calculator

The concentrate is 100% PG, this goes for all concentrates as far as I know, but could be some exceptions.

[Deleted]

Do you add vodka or water to the vg? ^^^^

I see on Ejuice me up there is allowance for it.
A very helpful thread as I am thinking of trying the ready made first and if I like it I will order the concentrate to knock it up. Also what vodka are you guys who use it, using. Are most peeps using a 60/40 PG/VG? Are you using a pyrex tank or will this be ok in say an iclear 30?

cheers

[jonoclouds]

Dec 31, 2013 11:27:43 GMT boyofford said:

Dec 31, 2013 11:03:02 GMT clivealive1 said:

...but assuming the red astaire has no pg vg this lessens the amount of pg/vg added and so does it still work right ?

The concentrate is 100% PG, this goes for all concentrates as far as I know, but could be some exceptions.

Most concentrates are in PG, a few are in alcohol. If you shake up or tilt the bottle of concentrate and it is thick and viscous then it's probably PG. If it is very thin and runny then it is probably alcohol. In my experience, the alcohol ones tend to be very intense fruit flavours and not much of them is needed in the recipe - sometimes only 2 or 3 percent. For these, I just ignore their effect on the PG:VG ratio.

[lairey]

I mix my RA 50/50 18mg and use it in an iclear 30s with no problem. I pre dilute my vg with 10% of whatever vodka is in the house but ignore the vodka % in the calculator and treat it as 100% PG.

as far as pg or vg for flavourings... the vast majority are PG based, so I assume it's pg when calculating.

[silentscream]

Dec 31, 2013 10:57:05 GMT xs2man said:

You don't really need to get a proper starter kit really. Do you have empty bottles from previous flavours? Just wash them out and use them, while you wait on fesh ones from Fasttech (https://www.fasttech.com/products/1411/10006152/1485901).

Then nip to Boots and pick up a 1ml, 5ml and 10ml syringes along with a bottle of their value glycol (this is your VG, and you can water it down with vodka / deionised water at 15-20%). There is already a link above to pretty much the best deal on nic base around, so I won't bother to link you to that, but you can either get your PG there, or here : www.ebay.co.uk/itm/130853413769?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649 (much cheaper, but a huge amount). Then all you need is your concentrate. So a 30ml bottle or two from T-Juice and your good to start.

As for why you need both PG and VG dilutants, well, it depends on what your mixing, what strength, what ratio and how strong your nic base is. But in general, I like to mix with a PG nic base at 72mg, to s strength of 18mg with 20% flavouring (for RA for example), with a 60/40 PG/VG ratio. So for a 10ml mix I use:

2.5ml Nic Base (25%)
1.5ml PG (15%)
4ml VG (40%)
2ml Flavouring (20%)

This gives me the perfect ratio, for me.  And in fact, assuming I just change the flavouring, and it is always 20% concentrate I use, the rest of the base stays the same, so when I'm mixing multiple flavours, I always mix the Nic base / PG / VG up first, in multiple bottles, then add flavours to each bottle depending on what I'm making.

Why did you choose 72mg PG nic base as opposed to say 36? What does it affect just the amount you put in?

So now you have PG in your nic base, some added PG, and PG in the flavouring too? Does the calculator work out all the overall amounts then? I'm probably making it more confusing than it actually is.
One more question why would you want to water down the VG what is the point of that? Thanks a lot for the tips xs2man I am enjoying your impromptu alchemy class

[Deleted]

Thanks Lairey I feel it in my waters..an urge now to order RA! Seems very popular.

[lairey]

The higher strength nic base works out cheaper in the long run as you use less... for example I use 72mg base and I mix at 18mg, so need 25% base. If I used 36mg base I woukd need twice the amount, but it's not half the price, if that makes sense?

I dilute my VG purely to make it easier to use. It's very viscous and gloopy undiluted and it's very hard to suck up in the syringe.

The ejuicemeup calculator works out everything for you. You just need to make sure you enter your nic base details, flavour % and required strength and PG/VG, then hit the calculate button. If you're unsure, post the resulting recipe on the mixology board and one of us will be happy to check your calculations for you

[lairey]

Dec 31, 2013 11:44:35 GMT @zero said:

Thanks Lairey I feel it in my waters..an urge now to order RA! Seems very popular.

You're welcome @zero.  If, by some remote chance, you decide it's not for you, someone will happily take it off your hands in the classies, so very low risk

[silentscream]

Dec 31, 2013 11:51:14 GMT lairey said:

The higher strength nic base works out cheaper in the long run as you use less... for example I use 72mg base and I mix at 18mg, so need 25% base. If I used 36mg base I woukd need twice the amount, but it's not half the price, if that makes sense?

I dilute my VG purely to make it easier to use. It's very viscous and gloopy undiluted and it's very hard to suck up in the syringe.

The ejuicemeup calculator works out everything for you. You just need to make sure you enter your nic base details, flavour % and required strength and PG/VG, then hit the calculate button. If you're unsure, post the resulting recipe on the mixology board and one of us will be happy to check your calculations for you

Brilliant, thanks a lot 

[xs2man]

Dec 31, 2013 11:42:39 GMT silentscream said:

Dec 31, 2013 10:57:05 GMT xs2man said:

You don't really need to get a proper starter kit really. Do you have empty bottles from previous flavours? Just wash them out and use them, while you wait on fesh ones from Fasttech (https://www.fasttech.com/products/1411/10006152/1485901).

Then nip to Boots and pick up a 1ml, 5ml and 10ml syringes along with a bottle of their value glycol (this is your VG, and you can water it down with vodka / deionised water at 15-20%). There is already a link above to pretty much the best deal on nic base around, so I won't bother to link you to that, but you can either get your PG there, or here : www.ebay.co.uk/itm/130853413769?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649 (much cheaper, but a huge amount). Then all you need is your concentrate. So a 30ml bottle or two from T-Juice and your good to start.

As for why you need both PG and VG dilutants, well, it depends on what your mixing, what strength, what ratio and how strong your nic base is. But in general, I like to mix with a PG nic base at 72mg, to s strength of 18mg with 20% flavouring (for RA for example), with a 60/40 PG/VG ratio. So for a 10ml mix I use:

2.5ml Nic Base (25%)
1.5ml PG (15%)
4ml VG (40%)
2ml Flavouring (20%)

This gives me the perfect ratio, for me.  And in fact, assuming I just change the flavouring, and it is always 20% concentrate I use, the rest of the base stays the same, so when I'm mixing multiple flavours, I always mix the Nic base / PG / VG up first, in multiple bottles, then add flavours to each bottle depending on what I'm making.

Why did you choose 72mg PG nic base as opposed to say 36? What does it affect just the amount you put in?

So now you have PG in your nic base, some added PG, and PG in the flavouring too? Does the calculator work out all the overall amounts then? I'm probably making it more confusing than it actually is.
One more question why would you want to water down the VG what is the point of that? Thanks a lot for the tips xs2man I am enjoying your impromptu alchemy class

As lairey says, 72mg nic base does work out cheaper.  And when I started, I was vaping at 36mg, so 36mg base wasn't any good anyway.  But really it's mostly a cost thing now.
Watering down the VG is just to thin it a little.  It's pretty thick and gloopy when it comes out the boots bottle.  But aids using the stuff.