UK bans proposed

[kate]

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but it looks like UK bans might be in the pipeline:

... Another point which the document addresses is the challenge in the enforcement of Smokefree legislation in public places:

“The inability to easily distinguish between a normal and an e-cigarette leads to confusion and upset amongst the public which can give rise to complaints as they believe that breaches of the legislation are taking place, and they are being subjected to cigarette smoke whilst in a no-smoking area. The use of e-cigarettes in premises where the law prohibits smoking could well encourage people to smoke, either in the mistaken belief that the law does not apply or is not being enforced, or that the individuals concerned will not be noticed and reported. There is also real potential for public order offences being committed where individuals are approached and asked or told to stop and this is challenged.”

After this the organisations go on to comment that they believe that electronic cigarettes should be classified as tobacco products and subject to the relevant legislation...

esmokerdirect.com/blog/proposed-uk-legislation-changes-to-include-electronic-cigarette/


If anyone wants to organise and discuss what we can do as activists we can get together here:
vapersnetwork.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=115&pid=780#pid780

Sorry if I don't come back here to discuss this but I'm not getting new post notifications from this forum for some reason and I won't know if anyone has posted until I get a chance to check back.

[Chrissie]

That is very worrying Kate

[beachboy]

W. T. F. ??? ??? ???
Words fail me, they really do
Blerdy Barstewards >

[kate]

I think this is the type of restriction that has just been approved in New Jersey. Bloomin' fascist control freaks.

[foxy9212]

The word 'tax' comes to mind - there's a large black hole in the budget that needs filling. If nicotine is now to become officially a tobacco product then that should apply to all such products including the cessation variety in all its forms should it not? If not I wonder what reasons will be given. The premise that people will mistake PVs for cigarettes and start lighting up in public places could surely be negated in an instant by signage indicating that e-cigarettes are permitted but not the regular type. That would be too simple I suppose.

Some years ago, during one of my failed 'giving up smoking' efforts I bought a Nicorette inhaler. It was a rather cheap and nasty plastic cigarette holder shaped device into which was placed a cartridge of liquid nicotine. The inhaler worked by releasing nicotine vapour/essence into the mouth and thereby into the blood stream to reduce cravings (unfortunately, without thinking, I picked up a lighter and burned the thing!) I wonder what the Great & Good would consider to be the difference between that device (which I think is still available) and an e-cigarette? It would be foolish to think one would be taking in less nicotine by using one as until I burned mine, I was constantly replacing the cartridges and drawing on it like a woman possessed! I'm certain I was taking in far more nicotine that way than from my cigs. This reeks of double standards to me.

The street corner men with pitbulls and bling seem to be creeping a little closer.

Fox

[Scylla]

Dec 18, 2009 14:56:22 GMT kate said:

Sorry if I don't come back here to discuss this but I'm not getting new post notifications from this forum

I don't think that notifications are a feature of this forum, I've been thru the settings ??? I think we'd all post a bit more responsively if what I call "alerts" were possible.

As for the main topic of your post - oh no

scylla

[kate]

I worked it out Scylla, you can get email notifications from here. You need to bookmark the thread and then manage bookmarks from your profile - that's where the email option is. Double check that you're subscribed after you change anything there, that's why I thought it didn't work at first, when I changed a bookmark to email notification I ended up having to bookmark again to get it to work.


Here are some discussions that I've been following and think would be handy to link together so we're all aware of what's being said:

ukvapers.com/showthread.php?t=129

vapersnetwork.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=115&page=1

forum.totallywicked-eliquid.co.uk/index.php?topic=4697.0

allaboute-cigarettes.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=general&action=display&thread=109

www.vapersforum.com/showthread.php?t=8038

A petition is being organised at UK Vapers and I've written to the three organisations who have allegedly been colluding to encourage restrictions on vapers - might as well get the facts right before we rush into anything.

[foxy9212]

I found this chap's take on e-cigarettes sensible and factual. You need to watch all of them really - he makes a good deal of sense.

One of the reasons given for the FDA stating e-cigarettes cannot be considered as NRT is that they do nothing to break the 'hand to mouth' habit. Does the Nicorette inhaler do that then?

Fox

[fishinahat]

Odd - I never knew that constantly moving my hand to my mouth was going to cause me anything more serious that a frozen shoulder or spots.

Is there something we haven't been told? ???

Incidentally - I think anyone who has some time to campaign should vigorously campaign to get that e-cig ad at the page tops banned. Since it is taking repeat CC payments and is likely to cause a huge amount of damage to the whole movement.

I will try to make some time to get round the links etc later in the day - but have an awful lot of stuff to do.


Incidentally - for the record - my stance on using the e-cig in places where smoking was banned has always been this:

I will use it discreetly - in places where everyone knows what it is (ie the staffroom) when I need to. I use it very discreetly in pubs and restaurants. I will not start "smoking" again in places where I have long been used to not smoking - such as on aeroplanes, in shops, on buses , inside hospitals - etc etc etc.

I think that doing so is likely to inflame the "anti" mob further and result in what we are seeing starting to happen - namely the people who are against smoking with a kind of Stalinist zeal - start to campaign to get it banned.

I have never approved of it being marketed as a way of "beating the ban" - or as a twenty-something's toy for using in the pub.

I am happy to call it a personal vapouriser - if this helps.......

[Scylla]

I never knew that constantly moving my hand to my mouth was going to cause me anything more serious that a frozen shoulder or spots.


Unfortunately, it's the ability to vape in non-smoking areas that is part of the attraction for me - to say that I get crabby when deprived of nicotine is putting it mildly, I get quite irrational (but have always been known as "highly strung", which I thought must make me "interesting" when I was young and very stupid ).

scylla

[foxy9212]

I'm afraid I'm not confrontional at all these days as I have a pretty hot temper. I haven't faced the problem of using my PV where cigs aren't allowed but perhaps it would be polite simply to ask if it's ok. Intellicig have a download available to registered members that can be printed off and carried around to 'educate' those who, like me a short while ago, have no idea what a PV is.

As to the 'misleading' e-cigarette advertisement mentioned by fishinahat, I've reported it to [e-mail] and all the other various organization concerned with such matters. I doubt it will make much difference but I shall continue to do that with all the adverts my spam box is filled with on a regular basis since I got caught with the Pure Lift/Clear Lift debacle! I also post warnings on every forum I use, both mine and other peoples'.

Fox

[Scylla]

I'm glad you've joined us, Foxy - we've lost (hopefully temporarily) a couple of pro-active, alert members and we (meaning "I") need people like you here

scylla

[Chrissie]

I second that Scylla It really is good to have you with us Foxy

[magicma]

MM

[kate]

RE: Proposed UK legislation
The Chartered Institute of Environmental Health replied to my email today with a copy of the letter they sent to the Dept of Health and a contact for us to talk to.

I've attached the letter to this post and will have a think about the points raised when I get a chance to look at it properly.

Any thoughts from yourself welcome, please say what you think and what might be a good course of action to present our case.
vapersnetwork.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=115&pid=864#pid864