Help! Juice is separating!

[Moon]

Dec 3, 2012 23:29:31 GMT smudge said:

What percentage of your mix is PG? If it's 50% or less, try increasing it and see if that helps. I'd have to look it up, but I'm not sure if VG is as effective as PG when it comes to getting oily flavourings to mix

I use about 70% PG, mate.

What a bummer, I really like the smell of the TF and I bunged some malic acid in to give it a bit of zing so was really looking forward to it.

[smudge]

Shame Can't think what else you could try really - if it won't disperse in 70% PG then I think you might be stuck. The thing is, PG (and VG) is used in the food industry because so many flavourings are "oily" (especially citrus types) and it's a safe way of getting them soluble. I guess if what you've got is still separating then it's just not going to mix. Do you know of any e-liquid vendors who sell any kind of tutti-frutti juice. Maybe they'd be willing to let you know what they use (and how they use it)?

[OneDay]

TPA do a tutti fruity, available at UKEliquid

[Moon]

Dec 3, 2012 23:47:38 GMT OneDay said:

TPA do a tutti fruity, available at UKEliquid

Have you tried it?

I got some from LF a couple of months ago and found it really weak.

[Moon]

Dec 3, 2012 23:44:46 GMT smudge said:

Shame Can't think what else you could try really - if it won't disperse in 70% PG then I think you might be stuck. The thing is, PG (and VG) is used in the food industry because so many flavourings are "oily" (especially citrus types) and it's a safe way of getting them soluble. I guess if what you've got is still separating then it's just not going to mix. Do you know of any e-liquid vendors who sell any kind of tutti-frutti juice. Maybe they'd be willing to let you know what they use (and how they use it)?

I'll maybe try mixing a few flavours together.

[Perpetua]

Dec 4, 2012 7:24:28 GMT Moon said:

Dec 3, 2012 23:47:38 GMT OneDay said:

TPA do a tutti fruity, available at UKEliquid

Have you tried it?

I got some from LF a couple of months ago and found it really weak.

What percentage did you mix at Moon?

On the whole, with some exceptions, I find TPA flavours to be on the weak side, so always mix at least 20%.

[Moon]

Dec 4, 2012 13:11:05 GMT Perpetua said:

Dec 4, 2012 7:24:28 GMT Moon said:

Have you tried it?

I got some from LF a couple of months ago and found it really weak.

What percentage did you mix at Moon?

On the whole, with some exceptions, I find TPA flavours to be on the weak side, so always mix at least 20%.

I worked my way up.

Started at 10% but finished at 30% and even then found it weak.

My first go at mixing was all with TPA from LF and I'd agree that all of those that I tried were weak, but the TF as well as the coconut were especially so.

The lime wasn't up to much either.

[azzie]

Your could also try the FA Tutti Fruiti. It is suggested that it is mixed around 5%, which is complete rubbish.

I found 20% to be more realistic. Nice vape however

[Moon]

Dec 4, 2012 16:32:07 GMT azzie said:

Your could also try the FA Tutti Fruiti. It is suggested that it is mixed around 5%, which is complete rubbish.

I found 20% to be more realistic. Nice vape however

Ta, might well give that a go.

[Perpetua]

This is the list someone has posted on ECF of suggested FA mixing concentrations on some of their flavourings . . . needless to say, of the ones that I've tried from that list, it's utter poppycock. FA I also find, although pleasant . . . very weak.


Barley Malt 2%
Beer 5%
Butterscotch 3%
Caramel 2%
Catalan Cream 5%
Cherry Black 4%
Chocolate 2%
Cinnamon Ceylon 5%
Cocoa 5%
Coconut 10%
Coffee Espresso 2%
Cookie 10%
Green Tea 3%
Hazelnut Toasted 2%
Irish Cream 3%
Licorice flavor 4%
Maple Syrup 2%
Nut Mix 3%
Oba Oba 10%
Peppermint 5%
Strawberry 2%
Tiramisu 4%
Torrone 4%
Vanilla Bourbon 5%
Vanilla Classic 2%
Vanilla Tahity 10%
Vienna Cream 10%

[Moon]

Dec 4, 2012 21:24:05 GMT Perpetua said:

This is the list someone has posted on ECF of suggested FA mixing concentrations on some of their flavourings . . . needless to say, of the ones that I've tried from that list, it's utter poppycock. FA I also find, although pleasant . . . very weak.


Barley Malt 2%
Beer 5%
Butterscotch 3%
Caramel 2%
Catalan Cream 5%
Cherry Black 4%
Chocolate 2%
Cinnamon Ceylon 5%
Cocoa 5%
Coconut 10%
Coffee Espresso 2%
Cookie 10%
Green Tea 3%
Hazelnut Toasted 2%
Irish Cream 3%
Licorice flavor 4%
Maple Syrup 2%
Nut Mix 3%
Oba Oba 10%
Peppermint 5%
Strawberry 2%
Tiramisu 4%
Torrone 4%
Vanilla Bourbon 5%
Vanilla Classic 2%
Vanilla Tahity 10%
Vienna Cream 10%

Cheers Perps.

Those percentages make me laugh, as when I first started mixing I used 'suggested' percentages like 5% and I might as well have added water for the effect they had on juice flavour.

Like you, I don't do subtle 'hints of' flavours and I want them in my face shouting what they are or what's the point?

[giles]

Referring to Tutti-Frutti:

Dec 3, 2012 23:02:54 GMT smudge said:

The weight/ml and refractive index both indicate that what you have is oil rather than water based. Aqueous solutions typically have a weight/ml near to or >1g and a refractive index of 1.3 - 1.4. Oils tend to be lighter/ml but have a higher refractive index. There are of course exceptions, but it definitely looks like you have an oil based liquid rather than aqueous, hence the separation. btw I'm no expert in food additives etc, just a simple chemist

and

Dec 3, 2012 22:30:45 GMT OneDay said:

CCW lemon is oil-based rather than PG, so not suitable for mixing

I wonder if this info should be in one of the stickies?

[Frogster (The Alchemist)]

Giles it is already, should anyone care to look, all the information about all the CCW flavourings has been made available here:-
allaboute-cigarettes.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=flavreviews&thread=13636&page=1#271278


For example, the Lemon MSDS says....

Product Name: Lemon Flavour
Product Code: 0762
Description: A light to pale yellow mobile liquid
Weight/ml.@ 20°C: 0.898 to 0.943
Refractive Index @ 20°C: 1.415 to 1.443
Acidity: nil
Preservative: Absent
Aroma: Citrus Lemon notes
Taste: Characteristic of Lemons
Suggested rate of use: From 0.1%
Suggested Applications:1. Fondants 2. General Confectionery
3. Ice Cream 4. Bakery
Solvent: Vegetable Oil
Legal Status: Natural
May be declared as: 1. Flavourings 2. Natural Flavourings
Additives Present: None
Not suitable for use in: N/a
Microbiological Information:
Nutritional Data /100g Total Plate Count: <2000 Calories (Kcals/KJ): 719/2957
Coliform/E.Coli: Absent
Carbohydrate: Nil
Yeasts and Moulds: Absent
Protein: Nil
Salmonella: Absent
Total Sugars: Nil
Fibre: Nil
Moisture: <1.0
Packing: plastic containers
Storage: Cool, away from direct light and strong odours
Shelf Life: 12 months from delivery.
This product is a concentrated flavouring for foodstuffs and it complies with current UK and EEC legislation.
Notes: Issue number 1 Date: 21.02.06
This copy issued:07/11/12
The information given is correct to the best of our knowledge at the time of issue.

[giles]

Yes, I saw that Frogster. Useful stuff and much appreciated. But I think it would be nice to have something that succeeded in stopping people from buying the flavours that won't work.

I agree that your list would do that if they read it properly and understood it, but I feel that a clear, short statement would help. I was thinking maybe in your CCW data sheets sticky a line at the end of the list for the flavour saying "Not recommended for vaping"; or an entry in the flavouring reviews sticky.

[Perpetua]

If you wanted to compile a list Giles, I'll happily add it to one of the stickies on the Flavouring Review Sub Board.