NHS e mail and my reply

[alvoram]

As I indicated Macca, that opinion is based on the assumption that the device was not listed as being able to use the batteries he bought. I don't know if you watched the show Macca, but he used non rechargable ones, CR123? I think, that were meant for cameras, didn't have a high enough C rating, and were stacked.

[maccafan]

I agree that for those in the know, it's basic stuff..

However, I think he will win his case or will get a large settlement out of court. There are some glaring omissions in the Prodigy 3.1 instruction manual about battery safety despite the fact that the mod is advertised as capable of 6v vaping with stacked batteries..

Edit: Product Manual

[alvoram]

you've answered my question there macca, if it's advertised as taking 2 CR123a's then the average user isn't going to know the difference between RCR's or CR's, been on here months now, and until yesterday, I didn't. I'm not sure the case is so clear cut now, there should be clear instructions on what batteries to use, and more importantly, which ones not to.

[hifistud]

Apr 18, 2012 13:35:24 GMT Queenie Bee said:

Can't wait HiFi how long have you bring doing vapour trails tv? I would have the balls to do a live show the haze hour makes me laugh and is very informative , it's like two blokes having a conversation in a pub! It is a refreshing change from watching the tv and so down to earth

We started on Feb 6th 2011 with the first show(s) and have broadcast four or five shows a week since then.

Thanks for the kind words on the Haze Hour - Keith and I have known each other for years, and he's a damned good mate - I love his attitude towards e-cigs... so grounded!!

[hifistud]

Apr 18, 2012 21:22:27 GMT Perpetua said:

Very informative and interesting show Hifi - don't know where the hour went to!

Aye - it absolutely flew by - flew!! The two minute warning really took me by surprise.

Glad you found it useful - hopefully many folks did and will...

[hifistud]

Apr 18, 2012 21:57:51 GMT alvoram said:

On the subject of people saying they used E-cigs to quit smoking. If that is such a problem why do we have the signatures, that say when our last cigarette was, and the section on the forums for posting anniversaries in. There is a hell of a lot of evidence that Ecigs are being used to quit smoking just by looking at the practices of this, and other forums, without even going into what people say, it's everywhere.

Seriously, I don't know why the forums have those anniversary sections, and I don't get the quit banners, either. Certainly, Totally Wicked was very strongly advised by the US government (ie. told in no uncertain terms) to remove all of that kind of thing from their forum, and similar advice was given with respect to the MHRA. Read the disclaimers that most e-cig vendors have on their websites - they know what the problem is. They don't want 'em medicalised any more than I do.

[alvoram]

I think that sort of thing is of more concern than people simply saying they have quit via ecigs, as the evidence is there, in black and white, and can be pulled up any time, anywhere, on most forums, with statistics to boot.

By the way it was a good show, I will be tuning in more often, very informative, just wish I'd been there on time to ask a few questions in chat, I registered earlier today aswell in preperation ##

[hifistud]

Thanks!

On the "quit" thing - the MHRA has a lovely little clause tucked away in the fine print that says (paraphrased) that if the preponderance of folks consider XXX to be for a medical purpose, then it IS for a medical purpose - amd therefore a medicine. So with vitamin tablets and such, they're now sold with "you but on a good day" and so on, rather than as it used to be when the vendors would list what each vitamin was responsible for in the body - medical info, you see.

The FDA's gone even dafter and tackled an outfit in the US that flogs walnuts - apparently, walnuts can do something nice in the body. The FDA cottoned on to the grower/vendor telling folks what was a scientific fact and has told 'em they've got to get the US version of an MA if they want to carry on telling folks this fact, linking to it, or even hinting about it. FFS - they're walnuts!!! But no, the FDA says that if they're sold with this medical fact attached, they're a medicine. The world has gone completely mad.

I'm not sure that I really want the kind of numbskulls that would go that far telling me what I can and can't do - they're patently not qualified to make those decisions on my behalf. It's all about control - he who controls the populace controls the money.

[Anne (fuzzy)]

The Kiwi fruit is extremely good for you. Did you know it can:

Prevent Asthma.
Prevent wheezing and coughing, especially in children
Protect our DNA from mutations.
Provide a healthy amount of antioxidants and vitamins.
Help prevent colon cancer thanks to a high fibre content.

Same difference.

[alvoram]

Apr 19, 2012 1:41:05 GMT Anne (fuzzy) said:

The Kiwi fruit is extremely good for you. Did you know it can:

Prevent Asthma.
Prevent wheezing and coughing, especially in children
Protect our DNA from mutations.
Provide a healthy amount of antioxidants and vitamins.
Help prevent colon cancer thanks to a high fibre content.

Same difference.

No Anne, I didn't. My lad is 8, and we noticed when he plays football he struggles with his breathing a little more than the other lads, some of whom's parents smoke in front of them, which we've never done, Grrrr. Have taken him to the doctors, but he pretty much said he should grow out of it, and it was nothing to worry about. They both like Kiwis, think I may try giving them a lot more if that is true.

Hifi, I'm not completely sold on the idea that this legislation would lead to your worst case scenario, and I still think there are some good sides to it that are often ignored. That being said, I admit I've still got a lot to learn, and also if it does lead to your worst case scenario, then I admit the negatives would far outweigh the positives, especially for us established vapers.

For that reason I'm going to remove my signature thingy, although it won't make a blind bit of difference whilst others still have one, IMO. From what you were saying in that show, and what you've said in your above post, that is all the evidence the MRHA would need for them to be classed as a cessation device, so let's just hope they don't come looking here, or on other forums.

Edit: point of note is that AAEC, unlike other places, have made it so that their signature banners can focus on vaping, and the amount of time doing that, which is a good thing, maybe, as an extension of that, the admins should ban the quit date signature banners, especially since they offer an alternative type of signature banner.... Gotta admit though, the colour won't go with my rams badges as well.

[womble]

Great show last night Hifi, for the first time for me, the hour really did fly by.

[hifistud]

Apr 19, 2012 10:28:01 GMT alvoram said:

Hifi, I'm not completely sold on the idea that this legislation would lead to your worst case scenario, and I still think there are some good sides to it that are often ignored. That being said, I admit I've still got a lot to learn, and also if it does lead to your worst case scenario, then I admit the negatives would far outweigh the positives, especially for us established vapers.

Let me be clear - I do think that if, as a body, we get our act together and present a compelling case to the powers that be, we can avoid the worst case scenario - but - and it's a big but - if we continue as we are, it's more likely that the end result will be skewed towards it - I'm pretty confident that's what Intellicig must be hoping for. And frankly, were I in their shoes, that's what I'd be pushing for.

For that reason I'm going to remove my signature thingy, although it won't make a blind bit of difference whilst others still have one, IMO. From what you were saying in that show, and what you've said in your above post, that is all the evidence the MRHA would need for them to be classed as a cessation device, so let's just hope they don't come looking here, or on other forums.

Can I say thank you for that - I and many others appreciate you doing that. As you say, it may be too late, but if everyone follows suit, we may be able to avoid the worst...
[/quote]

Edit: point of note is that AAEC, unlike other places, have made it so that their signature banners can focus on vaping, and the amount of time doing that, which is a good thing, maybe, as an extension of that, the admins should ban the quit date signature banners, especially since they offer an alternative type of signature banner.... Gotta admit though, the colour won't go with my rams badges as well. [/quote]

Oh, how I wish they would. It may upset some folks who are proud of what they've achieved, but the upside is it might just help the preponderance of e-cig users who would like to see tings carry on equitably.

On the colour - I'm colour blind - everything's fuchsia. Well, nearly everyhting!

[hifistud]

Apr 19, 2012 10:34:46 GMT womble said:

Great show last night Hifi, for the first time for me, the hour really did fly by.

Thank you so much. I've watched it back now, and yes, it does fly past.

[Queenie Bee]

Apr 19, 2012 10:28:01 GMT alvoram said:

Apr 19, 2012 1:41:05 GMT Anne (fuzzy) said:

The Kiwi fruit is extremely good for you. Did you know it can:

Prevent Asthma.
Prevent wheezing and coughing, especially in children
Protect our DNA from mutations.
Provide a healthy amount of antioxidants and vitamins.
Help prevent colon cancer thanks to a high fibre content.

Same difference.

No Ane, I didn't. My lad is 8, and we noticed when he plays football he struggles with his breathing a little more than the other lads, some of whom's parents smoke in front of them, which we've never done, Grrrr. Have taken him to the doctors, but he pretty much said he should grow out of it, and it was nothing to worry about. They both like Kiwis, think I may try giving them a lot more if that is true.

Hifi, I'm not completely sold on the idea that this legislation would lead to your worst case scenario, and I still think there are some good sides to it that are often ignored. That being said, I admit I've still got a lot to learn, and also if it does lead to your worst case scenario, then I admit the negatives would far outweigh the positives, especially for us established vapers.

For that reason I'm going to remove my signature thingy, although it won't make a blind bit of difference whilst others still have one, IMO. From what you were saying in that show, and what you've said in your above post, that is all the evidence the MRHA would need for them to be classed as a cessation device, so let's just hope they don't come looking here, or on other forums.

I have to disagree with removing my banner !why should I hide the fact that I have found an healthier alternative to smoking that I enjoy! The fact is the count of how many cigarettes I have avoided is a personal reminder to me of how many chemicals I have avoided with the switch over to vaping! I agreed with what you said in the show last night Hifi that if this was all banned tomorrow I would be off down the shop for a packet of cigs which would for me personally would feel like a huge failure ! I am a nicotine addict and and have a hand to mouth addiction if this was my only way to get my fix then this would have to be it ! Why do we think that so many heroine addicts go back to shooting up instead of sticking with the less dangerous methadone option? Because they are addicted to the delivery of their heroine they can't get their high in any other way. Same goes for smokers imho we need to inhale the nicotine and exhale a mist or smoke it's our method of delivery ! To sum my personal view on this I am a smoker I still have all the habits of a smoker but choose to do it with my PV the simple sad fact of the matter is the MHRA will do what ever they damn well please and IMHO I like the fact I can express myself freely I will not censor information I feel personally proud of !I refuse to go under ground so to speak and I will fight for what I believe in what ever it takes but I will not be censored in fear of how they could use this information against us ! Yes I know they will do this but I hate the idea of 'big brother' and all that it stands for and if we censor things on line they will find other ways of acquiring information IMO simple fact! Any way in the words of HIFI time to get of the saddle and dismount!

[alvoram]

That's up to you QB, but in fairness yours isn't one of the signatures we were actually talking about, there are some, like my old one, which state "quit date," that is all the proof they need. OK so "cigarettes avoided" could be interpreted the same way, but IMO it's not as bad as blatantly advertising the "quit smoking date" in relation to Ecig use.

You are right in that they will find other ways, imo of course, but I don't think that means people should make it easier for them. Like I said, and hifi has almost agreed, the worst case scenario doesn't have to be the outcome, but like he also said, we need to get our act together, for that to be so, making things as hard for them as possible is one of the ways in which we may well need to get our act together.