EU Poised to Ban Electronic Cigarettes

[suede]

Points well made ashmal--as I said in my previous post--- the industry is growing. Believe me Sony,toshiba etc etc will all have plans for ecigs. Just as the tobacco companies have spent millions on cannabis marketing just waiting for it to become legal. I think all this banning talk stemming from a "leaked memo" is pure knee jerk

[vapee]

They'll eventually make an ecig like the emagic (I think its called) from this film www.imdb.com/title/tt0280674 The First $20 Million Is Always the Hardest
Wow their box office stats are seriously low, must have been a really random film
Its basically a device that gives off a hologram or virtual reality system

[raid2506]

Dec 6, 2012 13:42:47 GMT alvoram said:

Dec 6, 2012 11:04:26 GMT kibbster said:

If the whole country switched from Tobacco to e-cigs tomorrow the country would be in trouble with the lost revenue.
Not that it's ever going to happen, but each vaper costs the UK government money in lost revenue... they don't like that and are unlikely to stand for it when they notice enough people doing it (i.E They lose an appreciable amount of revenue.)

I was under the impression that smokers cost the tax payer more than they give in by paying tobacco duty, they are a massive drain on the NHS.

I think you'll find that's down to some clever book keeping and a bit of spin.

I have smoked 29 years and never had any medical treatment for a smoking related illness.

You will probably find that if you smoke but go to the doc with a sprained ankle it still goes under the 'smoker' account.

[giles]

Dec 6, 2012 11:37:15 GMT kibbster said:

If they recommend it's regulated then we are in trouble.

I think some legislation (or enforcement of guidelines) is inevitable. Right now I think you could legally sell vaping to children which can't be right, and the labelling of juices is abysmal. It would be nice to think that they'll do something sensible about these things. Probably too much to expect that that is all they'll do.

I don't think they'll ban e cigs, but I think that there is a small but real risk that NICE will recommend legislation designed to make it a pharma product. Banning sale of juice at more than say 18mg, maybe banning it outside of carts, making it a "medical" product so that it can only be sold in chemists. Big pharma is the most powerful lobby at NICE, and they have an industry to protect.

I've bought 3 year's supply of nic. I don't think I'll need it, but it is cheap insurance.

[hifistud]

www.clivebates.com/ applies.

[Banky]

Signed

[Deleted]

been reading around the matter, i.e. Sweden's reaction to snus (snuff) which is as I understand a safer form of nicotine as opposed to cigarettes much like our beloveds. www.thelocal.se/43190/20120912/#.UMDQsIPKLKQ

Interesting ... does anyone know whether a single country veto can kill this idea off within the EU? I suppose Sweden could get snus' entry on the proposal removed. Anyway, last sentence on the website is as follows :

"The EU’s new directive on tobacco is expected to come into effect in 2014. "

I can't vouch for the accuracy of this article but if correct we have a while yet to see what it turns into

[Banky]

Dec 6, 2012 10:00:40 GMT raid2506 said:

I think it may be a good idea for everyone to speak with their GP's and possibly MP's about this.

Pointing out that after xx years of addicted smoking you have been able to quit/reduce thanks to this system.

It may not seem like much but it will then be on your medical records and could pave the way for legal action if there is any sort of ban and you end up back on stinkies.

It would be bad for any EU/UK body to try to defend a class action against 500/1000 of us or more.

Also note that whilst most GP's seem useless they do talk to each other at conferences etc and some good may come of it.

Bear in mind that there is no 'obvious' reason to ban e-cigs, no history of people dying from them, or crimes comitted to support the habit. It seems like purely a business and political decision.

I'm off to sign the petition.

I did speak to my Doctor and Consultant and got both their approval and it is noted on my medical records non smoker.

[hoppers]

I see it the same as giles, maybe some attempt at legislation/control of eliquid quality/strength/source/labelling etc etc. Possibly maybe some control/duty on liquid nicotine.

It's more likely that they will be interested in the age restriction side of it and clarifying/changing the law to clearly include e-cig products. Go onto the trading Standards website and there is no mention, everything is based around 'tobacco products' and tobacco is the leaf, isn't it? this is pretty much it,
Since 1st October 2007 it is illegal to sell tobacco products to anyone under 18 years of age – this includes cigarettes, cigars, roll-your-own and pipe tobacco as well as cigarette rolling papers.
It'll certainly be confusing for the retailer/shop assistant/trading standards officer/Police as to whether e-cigs are classed as 'tobacco products'. More than likely they are under the category 'common sense/advisory'. The law around tobacco product sales may have to be changed/reworded to include nicotine products or something of that nature. I bet the CPS wouldn't currently attempt to prosecute a sale to a minor.
walk into my local off licence and you will see a big E-Lites counter display with all the kit, leaflets round the shop, poster in the window, probably a sales assistant stood behind the counter who isn't sure who can buy them. Yet, cigs are hidden from view behind a roller shutter. In these cases there may be a case to answer that e-cigs could encourage taking up smoking.

So, changing/rewording the law as per the above, might also subject e-cigs to the same marketing restrictions, no above or below the line advertising, no displaying in the store (post 2015), plain packaging laws (possibly in the future) etc etc

It's entirely possible that they may just clarify the tobacco laws/change the wording to include nicotine products/tobacco replacement products or something of that nature.

[Skwoddy]

I think "Ban on marketing" is the key phrase in this latest form, If its good for the cigarettes not to be advertised then its good for the alternatives, or am I wrong?, That said, bans on advertisements for NRT should also be looked at.

Still , makes me scream that they are so quick to suggest bans on Nicotine alternatives and leave cigarettes alone... sick to the stomach.

Death merchants..

[andy01424]

signed and put links on my Facebook Page

[Blownupdolly]

Dec 6, 2012 11:28:35 GMT kibbster said:

Yes part of the problem is the Daily Fail brigade saying "Oh noes thinks of the children/ kittens/ pandas, look-a-likes will make children smoke" or some such bollocks.
As long as they are the minority they can be easily ignored as crackpots but if the press and general public jump on that bandwagon we can very quickly have a problem.

Hopefully, there is enough common sense left in the world for people to not do that... ah hell who am I kidding!

People fear something new, smoking is the new evil (Every wardrobe still has a terrorist and there's a paedo in every child's wardrobe still!)
Anything that in anyway is linked to smoking WILL get tarred with the same brush, generally by people who believe stuff they read in the papers or what their mate down the pub tells them.

They are unfortunately the great unwashed masses and they also unfortunately hold power in the country because of their numbers. (number of votes.)

The government will bow to these people if they shout loud enough.
That's what worries me the most.

What can we do about them?
Very little, as we can't control what they do try to ignore them IMHO, if it becomes illegal in the UK to sell vaping stuff then unfortunately we'll have to order direct from China.
I still think it's possible but very unlikely.

Much more likely that legislation will be involved, an accidental contamination in China with our Juices killing someone (Powered milk anyone?) will result in a ban or at the very least legislation faster than I could vape a tank of my favorite juice!
I think that's the most pressing worry IMHO.

I still blame the Daily Fail for everything bad in life

If the type of ban they could install drives UK vendors out of business, would it still be legal to purchase hardware and juice from other countries and receive it here?

[giles]

Dec 6, 2012 18:53:00 GMT Blownupdolly said:

If the type of ban they could install drives UK vendors out of business, would it still be legal to purchase hardware and juice from other countries and receive it here?

Hardware yes. Also flavours, PG, VG. Not (in the worst case) legally, nicotine.

[andy01424]

and just as your about to say Booooo! Marlboro are joining in surprise!!
www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-12-05/e-cigarette-maker-njoy-seen-as-takeover-target-amid-innovation.html

[comfrey]

Oh my I have to confess I like the sound of them. I used to enjoy a Marlborough or 50