e cig users told they have to use smoking shelter at work,

[Deleted]

Jul 30, 2013 13:24:41 GMT ausfost said:

@tall thanks for pointing out that glaring error will change it on hardcopy

Hey that's what we're here for mate  I don't know about you but I pretty much say "smoking" when I'm talking to people about vaping, it makes it easier to understand I think.

[raid2506]

That sucks ausfost, but here is a short round up:

Any employer has the right to allow or not, smoking and/or vaping on site.

Unless it's in an employment contract there is no right to any breaks outside of statutory rest periods.

Many employers provide a smoking shelter as a means of retaining staff and appeasing visitors but are not obliged to.

No employer can insist that an employee endanger their health by being in the same place that smoking is going on but can insist smokers use a designated area.

Smokers and vapers have no rights over those who chose not to.

The only work around is if the employer insists that staff remain on site during breaks, or if it would be unreasonable to expect a smoker to leave site to do so.
Then a suitable place (away from their work station) should be provided for employees to dispose of their time as they wish.

As it stands there is little or no legal precedent for either grouping vapers with smokers or apart from them. It will take several unfair/constructive dismissal cases before there is any clarity.

Personally I would send the letter, the worst it will do is clarify the situation at head office level rather than it being an arbitrary rule by a biased manager.

[Karma]

What I do is nod my head, go out with the smokers when I want to get out and have a gossip, at other times stealth vape

[andyb2]

Some of the large oil company operators - ie BP, Shell and Nexen in the North Sea have now banned the use or carraige of e-cigs onto their offshore installations.
And remember when you work out there you dont go home at night so you effectively have the choice - smoke cigarretes or use some NRT like gum or patches or stop.
So tread carefully about how you prod these employers - banning vaping on their premises is an easy solution for them and perfectly legal with no discrimatory laws against them.

[fagin]

I'm lucky I suppose, been vaping in the office for a year and a half and I don't even think anyone except visitors even notices it any more,

[richo71]

I have had the very same thing when my company literally added e-cigs to the company policy on smoking, obviously i am challenging this as it was just added as an amendment because on our company policy it states the 2007 smoking law ban and within this law the company has a duty of care to protect all employees from second hand smoke (that includes us) (e-cigs are not part of the 2007 law) so sending me to the smoking shelter the company are failing me as an employee and are liable. I first started the challenge to the policy change through my union rep who agreed and is now in the hands of HR dept and the last i heard was that it was under review so in the meantime i am vaping away in the messroom. (Remember all companies big or small have a duty of care to all employees and visitors to the site)

[richo71]

Jul 30, 2013 19:34:23 GMT andyb2 said:

Some of the large oil company operators - ie BP, Shell and Nexen in the North Sea have now banned the use or carraige of e-cigs onto their offshore installations.
And remember when you work out there you dont go home at night so you effectively have the choice - smoke cigarretes or use some NRT like gum or patches or stop.
So tread carefully about how you prod these employers - banning vaping on their premises is an easy solution for them and perfectly legal with no discrimatory laws against them.

surely its just as easy to ban smoking on the rig as-well then, i cant beleive you can smoke on the rig but you cant vape 

[giles]

Jul 30, 2013 11:36:39 GMT ausfost said:

does it really come across as a bullying letter?

I guess it depends who reads it, but I think that the references to legislation and to constructive dismissal could be interpreted as an attempt to scare them a bit. If that isn't your intention, then personally I'd leave them out.

[ausfost]

on discussion with my wife and the other vaper's she works with they feel maybe the tone of the original post may well be a bit too stern and they fear that it may well result in a ban, so back to the drawing board for now to come up with something more light hearted, referencing facts about vaping etc and including things that may be easier to associate with understanding that some Vapers have replaced smoking with ecigs eg: "would you ask an alcoholic to sit in the bar?"

[inigomontoya]

Jul 30, 2013 20:31:48 GMT richo71 said:

surely its just as easy to ban smoking on the rig as-well then, i cant beleive you can smoke on the rig but you cant vape 

My thoughts exactly. How weird is that! You'd imagine they'd ban smoking as it is!

[neptune]

It`s a very long time since I worked as an employee, having been self employed for many years before I retired. Employers range from the brilliant to the abysmal. I spent a year as a Union Shop Steward, which believe me is a very difficult job to do, if there is any trouble, you are automatically involved in it. I always found diplomacy to be the best approach. If there are only a few vapers compared to smokers, I would have a word with the immediate supervisor, and get permission to stand close to, and upwind of the smoking shelter. Have umbrellas handy for rainy days. That way you can still chat to your smoking pals without breathing their smoke. Sometimes, a good old British compromise is the answer.

[scooter1]

Man this is just pure ignorance on the part of the Employers ,they dont know if ecigs can cause harm or not because it has never been proved ,So what they say is "we will just ebb on the side of caution".

Iam now hearing this word "Normalized" all the time ,they dont want Ecigs to become normal or a life trend where workers would slow down production using their ecigs.

They have looked for ways to discredit ecigs the harm side does'nt work anymore as they are proved to save life's .

Also today the University of Dundee banned ecigs to try to stop them being normalized within the student community.
Did'nt they try the same with rock and roll music.

[GunJack]

the whole "normalized" thing is because "they" think that seeing other people walking round anywhere in clouds of vape will encourage people to think that smoking is fine'n'dandy and "normal" ?? and encourage others to start smoking.... go figure ??

[GunJack]

In terms of employers, you must remember it's a case of "their house, their rules" regardless of how good/bad/barking those rules are. By all means challenge such decisions in a reasonable, rational way, but remember ultimately it is their decision regardless of the fact the law banning cigs in the workplace does not cover e-cigs.

[Deleted]

Both Universities in aberdeen have banned e-cigs so the university of Dundee is just them copying

Why worry? Get your degree from St.Andrew's instead (way better uni)